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The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

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Re: The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

#291

Post by jl6 »

tomp wrote: post #289
jl6 wrote: post #283

Diamonds are a scam and an ethical minefield, but I disagree with the notion that women are brainwashed or shallow for wanting one. It’s not about the diamond. It’s about wanting a man with enough resources to waste on a diamond. A diamond’s lack of intrinsic value or utility is a feature. The waste is the point. In a sea of potential mates, finding one who can throw away $3000 as though it were nothing, is a great f…

This sounds like a sensible argument unless you think about it for about 5 seconds. In reality, most of those women absolutely wouldn’t want said man to literally burn $3k or even $20k. Absolutely 100% brainwashed.

Are you completely sure?

https://caratsandcake.com/articles/wedding-fireworks-wedding...

“Wedding fireworks can cost anywhere between $3,000 and $25,000, according to Theiss—it all depends on timing and the size of the show you want. The more common range is $3,000 to $5,000 for weddings.”

Re: The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

#292

Post by lelanthran »

gnicholas wrote: post #112
bombcar wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And make sure you appraise her of it - shenanigans like buying something else and passing it off as a diamond could result in her being absolutely embarrassed in front of her friends, which should not be a position you want to put her in.

From what I hear, moissanite (and man-made diamonds) are pretty much indistinguishable from natural diamonds. How would someone's friends figure out that it's not a natural diamond? I would think the only way the wife would know is if she asked about the diamond's papers, if she was going to get an insurance policy for it or something.

> How would someone's friends figure out that it's not a natural diamond? I would think the only way the wife would know is if she asked about the diamond's papers, if she was going to get an insurance policy for it or something.

It actually doesn't matter how she finds out that you lied to her about the biggest life change she will ever experience for the rest of her life. What matters is that lying to a person you want to marry is a sure-fire way to end the marriage at some definite future point.

Arguing that it's okay because you will never be found out isn't relevant.

Re: The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

#293

Post by lelanthran »

cactusplant7374 wrote: post #85
bombcar wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And make sure you appraise her of it - shenanigans like buying something else and passing it off as a diamond could result in her being absolutely embarrassed in front of her friends, which should not be a position you want to put her in.

Not everyone wants to spend $20,000 on a rock so that their spouse isn’t “embarrassed in front of her friends.”

> Not everyone wants to spend $20,000 on a rock so that their spouse isn’t “embarrassed in front of her friends.”

That's not the argument, AIUI. The argument is "Go ahead and spend $FOO on a rock, just be sure not to lie about how much you spent".

Re: The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

#294

Post by rerdavies »

SenAnder wrote: post #27
jamiek88 wrote: post #4

Has anyone ever tried to sell an engagement or wedding ring with diamonds? You get cents on the dollar. Even or I should say especially brand names like Tiffany. The whole thing is a scam from start to finish and I wish I could go back in time and avoid the entire thing.

> Has anyone ever tried to sell an engagement or wedding ring with diamonds? You get cents on the dollar. Does that mean you can buy one second-hand at a low price, and avoid the inflated market entirely?

You can buy a second-hand synthetic diamond for even less!

Re: The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

#295

Post by amrocha »

defrost wrote: post #264
amrocha wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if it's "clean" relative to worse places, it's still not ethical. Mining is still dangerous work. The workers are still underpaid. The profits are still stolen by companies that are literally the vestiges of European colonialism.

There are a lot of diamond mines, many in Canada, a number in Australia, there are a number that are mobile marine based ventures with state of the art ships sucking in sediments and sifting for diamonds. https://edition.cnn.com/2018/09/03/africa/marine-diamond-min... None of your comments applies to any of the mines mentioned; Canada, Australia, and the marine operations all abide by OSHA regulations and pay good wa…

If you think that just because a mine isn't in Africa that means it's a good place to work then I disagree

Re: The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

#296

Post by zlg_codes »

c0pium wrote: post #199
jonkho wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reality is the person with lower leverage in the relationship does the keeping of the one with higher leverage happy. In marriages men have the lower leverage due to various reasons. One of which is favorable treatment of women in the family courts.

If you’re thinking about marriage in terms of leverage you’ve guaranteed you’re going to find out about those courts.

Given that marriage is a business decision, it's absolutely important to be aware of the positions you could possibly end up in, and which situations each of you has society's favor in should a conflict arise. (hint: men are disfavored in family court by default) It's not always happier ever after.

We should not normalize people making rash decisions and chaining themselves to someone to fulfill cultural fantasies about romance. Don't marry someone you're not willing to walk to the grave with.

Re: The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

#297

Post by lelanthran »

amrocha wrote: post #118
xivzgrev wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Guys, buying diamonds, can complain all day about what a rip off it is (it is). But if you apprise your fiancé of the alternatives / opp costs (moissanite, man made, second hand, etc) and she still wants a new diamond, just get her a new diamond. It will make her happy for years. My wife had her heart set on a pink diamond, so that’s what I got her. I made it clear though that if I got this, she is not getting a new…

If she wants a diamond despite knowing all the misery the diamond industry spreads, then you should probably just break up

> If she wants a diamond despite knowing all the misery the diamond industry spreads, then you should probably just break up

Doesn't it matter what he thinks?

Does "If she wants to eat meat despite knowing all the misery the food industry spreads, then you should probably break up" sound like a good idea to a guy who isn't vegan/vegatarian/etc?

Re: The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

#298

Post by serf »

blindhippo wrote: post #274
atleastoptimal wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't marry anyone whose happiness is dependent on a artificially expensive hard and shiny rock whose prestige was inflated for years by an industry built on slave labor, especially when far less expensive alternatives exist. If she is apprised of the alternatives and still demands "No I want EXPENSIVE shiny thing" then it's cultural shaming factoring into the decision making. You have to reevaluate what she see…

Yikes, that's quite the binary distinction... Surely there is room between those subjective descriptions of people for "hey, I like this thing even though it's irrational, ok?" Let people live their lives and you do you. People aren't a "provider mannequin" just because they like to make their partner happy.

acknowledgement of irrationality, especially one that isn't accompanied with a wish to better themselves away from that irrationality, would be a major red flag for me personally entering into a long-term relationship.

there is also a great distinction between "Yeah I know another helping of chocolate syrup on my ice cream is a bad decision, but it'll make me feel good today.", and "You need to make a 10kUSD+ purchase on a totally arbitrary piece of jewelry that very well may have incited real human suffering and violence, even though I know that desire is irrational and poorly balanced."

I would assume -- maybe incorrectly, I admit -- that this form of irrationality would follow the individual and subsequently the entire relationship.

We all have different 'red flag dictionaries', so by all means people should live their lives; but I doubt I am alone in my assumptions.

Re: The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

#299

Post by chewz »

Retric wrote: post #207
seattle_spring wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Splurging every once in a while does not inherently make someone “fiscally irresponsible.” For many people, especially on this forum, $3k-$5k for a ring is literally a few days work or less worth of pay. (Please no one get pedantic on ring cost to me, absolutely not the point of this comment)

It’s not the cost that’s the issue, it’s the underlying desire. Belief in astrology is seemingly harmless, but it’s a sign of underlying irrationality that I find unacceptable. The ritual around a hunk of carbon is the same category of thinking IMO. Also, ‘a few days salary’ rather defeats the rituals purpose.

> Belief in astrology is seemingly harmless, but it’s a sign of underlying irrationality that I find unacceptable.

How about spirituality or religion?

Re: The diamond world takes radical steps to stop a pricing plunge

#300

Post by lelanthran »

seattle_spring wrote: post #206
CalRobert wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My cousin's wife has cut him off from our entire family.

Not necessarily bad without knowing more about the parties involved. Some families are toxic and awful and should be cut off.

> Not necessarily bad without knowing more about the parties involved. Some families are toxic and awful and should be cut off.

Maybe, but even in that case, you can't trust a spouse to do the cutting off because they are most definitely not unbiased.

If the cousin in question would have cut off ties without his wife telling him to, you might have a point, but the way the OP phrased it makes it seem, to me, that it was done due to instructions from the wife.

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