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How I got here

pthorpe92.github.io

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Re: How I got here

#281

Post by verisimi »

qingcharles wrote: post #237
hereme888 wrote: post #213

I could have been that guy, and worse. When I was 19 I got caught selling a bunch of MDMA at a night club. Undercover police caught me, and by God's grace they chose to let me go. MDMA had just begun to carry a minimum 10 yr prison sentence throughout the state. I had no idea what I was doing in my life, like I was asleep and not awake, until I got caught that night. About 15 minutes into the interrogation at the sce…

That man gave you your entire life back. It's not just the time you would have served, but it would have ruined so much of the rest of your life too.

He did give him back his life.

But how is it possible that his life was at risk at all? Why a 10 year sentence for taking drugs? The government should simply not have that power.

Re: How I got here

#282

Post by OfSanguineFire »

hereme888 wrote: post #248
Fischgericht wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should not have been arrested. MDMA should have been legal. End of story. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-023-02565-4 https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34708874/ https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/18/well/mind/mdma-ecstasy-ri... https://www.euronews.com/next/2023/07/03/australia-just-lega... It's legal or decriminalized in Portugal, The Czech Republic, The Netherlands, and Switzerland, by the way. Surprise: Tho…

Haha I understand your point. But it is a dangerous substance when used without medical supervision. And more importantly, what I was selling was presumably MDMA. I didn't have kits to check the batches for adulteration. What if people died? I was not ready for that responsibility.

I wonder how many people here would agree with your claim "it is a dangerous substance when used without medical supervision". Often in hacker circles soft drugs are viewed as something people can take on their own provided that, as you suggest, purity is guaranteed. And while setting and trusted and savvy companionship is important, the involvement of a medical professional may kill the whole freespirited vibe.

Re: How I got here

#283

Post by _heimdall »

skrebbel wrote: post #277
hereme888 wrote: post #213

I could have been that guy, and worse. When I was 19 I got caught selling a bunch of MDMA at a night club. Undercover police caught me, and by God's grace they chose to let me go. MDMA had just begun to carry a minimum 10 yr prison sentence throughout the state. I had no idea what I was doing in my life, like I was asleep and not awake, until I got caught that night. About 15 minutes into the interrogation at the sce…

Offtopic, but minimum sentences are nuts. What's the point of judges and juries etc if we make the law so aggressive that they hardly have a say anymore?

Juries ultimately have the final say in conviction. Its well within their right to go not guilty for any reason.

Judges and lawyers absolutely hate it, but juries aren't there just as a logical check on laws as written and facts as presented. Juries are a check on the legal system and laws themselves.

Re: How I got here

#284

Post by Obscurity4340 »

verisimi wrote: post #281
qingcharles wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That man gave you your entire life back. It's not just the time you would have served, but it would have ruined so much of the rest of your life too.

He did give him back his life. But how is it possible that his life was at risk at all? Why a 10 year sentence for taking drugs? The government should simply not have that power.

Its kind of ironic that most law and order folks would consider this an example or dirty cops being dirty or privilegeor whatever. The fact is, this stuff doesn't really seem to happen anymore unless you're the Prime Ministers wife or something

Re: How I got here

#285

Post by closewith »

scbrg wrote: post #270
closewith wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you honestly believe this, you've never been truly hungry. Most to all people will kill for food.

While that's probably true, I don't really see its relevance. I'm fairly certain that exactly zero of the people spending prison time for murder in my country committed murder because they were hungry. I'm open to the possibility that the situation may be different in other countries, but I strongly doubt it's a leading cause pretty much anywhere.

Well, as Lord Beaverbrook might have said, we've already established that we're all potential criminals. All we're haggling about now is the threshold that would cause us to commit a crime.

Without having lived the lives of others, you simply don't know if you would have committed the same (or worse) crimes in their situation. That doesn't mean we can't or shouldn't punish crimes, but to imagine that you're a better person than most criminals is just self-flattery.

Re: How I got here

#286

Post by _heimdall »

mormegil wrote: post #263
Fischgericht wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should not have been arrested. MDMA should have been legal. End of story. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-023-02565-4 https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34708874/ https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/18/well/mind/mdma-ecstasy-ri... https://www.euronews.com/next/2023/07/03/australia-just-lega... It's legal or decriminalized in Portugal, The Czech Republic, The Netherlands, and Switzerland, by the way. Surprise: Tho…

I don't think MDMA is "legal or decriminalized" in the Czech Republic...? Sure, consumption of _anything_ is decriminalized here (you are allowed to possess only a tiny amount for your own consumption) but other than that, owning, offering, selling, importing, etc. MDMA is very much criminalized here!

How does that work exactly? How does one end up with a tint amount for personal consumption if someone else couldn't legally allowed to have enough to sell?

Seems really strange that the government would have bothered decriminalizing consumption if the supply itself is illegal.

Re: How I got here

#287

Post by skrebbel »

_heimdall wrote: post #283
skrebbel wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Offtopic, but minimum sentences are nuts. What's the point of judges and juries etc if we make the law so aggressive that they hardly have a say anymore?

Juries ultimately have the final say in conviction. Its well within their right to go not guilty for any reason. Judges and lawyers absolutely hate it, but juries aren't there just as a logical check on laws as written and facts as presented. Juries are a check on the legal system and laws themselves.

Sure, but saying someone is not guilty when obviously they are but a 10 year prison sentence is way out of proportion for what they did, that’s stupid too right? It means we expect juries to lie, on purpose, to prevent ruining someone’s life. It forces juries to pick between two bad extremes.

These kinds of laws remove the opportunity for juries (or judges where I live) to eg say “6 months of community service” when it’s more appropriate.

Re: How I got here

#288

Post by daggersandscars »

theoldlove wrote: post #254
codingrightnow wrote: post #171

As a former software engineer for over a decade and current corrections officer in a max level state facility, this is a very interesting topic. My facility has a large college presence within it. While there are problems with it, I think overall it is probably a net positive for the staff and inmates. At the same time, I don't believe that we have more than maybe a small handful of nonviolent/drug offenders; anybody…

Some statistics here: https://www.prisonpolicy.org/reports/pie2023.html ~60% of the state prison population (~600k of ~1m) are imprisoned for a violent crime. Much higher than I would have guessed.

One of the article's key points is that violent crime does not mean "caused physical harm" and that entire categories of crime are considered violent by law, whether or not any violence was perpetrated during the commission.

"The fourth myth: By definition, “violent crime” involves physical harm

The distinction between “violent” and “nonviolent” crime means less than you might think; in fact, these terms are so widely misused that they are generally unhelpful in a policy context. In the public discourse about crime, people typically use “violent” and “nonviolent” as substitutes for serious versus nonserious criminal acts. That alone is a fallacy, but worse, these terms are also used as coded (often racialized) language to label individuals as inherently dangerous versus non-dangerous."

Re: How I got here

#289

Post by polygamous_bat »

_heimdall wrote: post #286
mormegil wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think MDMA is "legal or decriminalized" in the Czech Republic...? Sure, consumption of _anything_ is decriminalized here (you are allowed to possess only a tiny amount for your own consumption) but other than that, owning, offering, selling, importing, etc. MDMA is very much criminalized here!

How does that work exactly? How does one end up with a tint amount for personal consumption if someone else couldn't legally allowed to have enough to sell? Seems really strange that the government would have bothered decriminalizing consumption if the supply itself is illegal.

Why is that weird? You can have food, you can make food for yourself and your friend, but if you’re selling cooked food to strangers you need to have minimum standards of cleanliness etc.

Re: How I got here

#290

Post by DragonL80 »

morgante wrote: post #276
Aeolun wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think for all the criminals that are going to be released back into society at some point, recidivism should be at the top of our mind, not punishment. If you can stop them from doing it again by locking them up in comfort for 10 years instead of discomfort for 20, then that is what we should do (assuming that doesn’t cause more people to do it in the first place).

> If you can stop them from doing it again by locking them up in comfort for 10 years instead of discomfort for 20, then that is what we should do. You're never going to stop many of them from reoffending. Even the "best" rehabilitation programs have crime rates far above the general population. The additional 10 years is 10 more years where they can't hurt innocent people. The justice system exists for the benefit o…

Yeah the punishments for the war on drugs has worked SO WELL. /s
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