The Crisis in American Walking • Hacker News Board

Re: The Crisis in American Walking

#71

Post by bitwize » Tue, Apr 10, 2012, 7:15 PM UTC

SandersAK wrote: post #62

danso wrote: post #10

In NYC, I think nothing of a 30min to 1-hour walk to get to dinner. In my hometown, where there are sidewalks connecting my house to the "downtown", I can barely walk 3 blocks without feeling weird. It's not just the practical distance, or how "safe" it is to conduct the walk... it's the strangeness of walking through something not as dense as NYC. I've done far less formal exercise these days than I ever have at any…

I pretty much walk or bike everywhere in Brooklyn. When I go home to Oregon, we're constantly in the car. "Getting a coffee" consists of getting in a car, driving for 5 minutes, grabbing a to-go cup at Starbucks and driving back home... I can't really do it anymore.

Must not be Portland, where driving makes you one of the untouchables, as distinguished from the Master Race astride their bicycles, kitted out in TRON gear.

Re: The Crisis in American Walking

#72

Post by gamble » Tue, Apr 10, 2012, 7:16 PM UTC

Not mentioned is the fact that something like 2/3 of traffic deaths in the US are pedestrians struck by vehicles. That's around 20,000 people per year.

Auto manufacturers are pretty good at protecting the people inside the car, but we're not so good at protecting pedestrians.

Re: The Crisis in American Walking

#73

Post by dhimes » Tue, Apr 10, 2012, 7:16 PM UTC

backprojection wrote: post #66

"Carlin Robinson, 12, walks from her grandmother's car to the school bus in Manchester, Ky. Her house can be seen in the background. A study published in 2010, investigating high obesity rates in the town found that residents used cars to minimize walking distance, to the detriment of their health." Association != causation. While the picture this caption is from is indeed ridiculous (grandmother driving her daughter…

Exactly. The organized sports for kids is insane in its breadth and depth. We used to play one, maybe two sports. Now normal kids are playing something most seasons. Not only are they playing, but they are going to special coaching sessions, camps, and so on. This is much more prevalent today than when I was a kid.

We had football practice twice a week (at 12 yo) with a game on Saturday.

She got a ride to the end of the driveway? Probably because she has a double-header soccer match that night. A soccer match at which some parents will get into a fistfight- but that's for another thread.

Re: The Crisis in American Walking

#74

Post by flurdy » Tue, Apr 10, 2012, 7:17 PM UTC

jgw wrote: post #38

Sort of related - a funny observation that might amuse Americans about us wacky Canucks: An awful lot of Canadians, myself included, avoid drive-through ATMs, and instead park and walk into the bank. And sometimes, when the bank's busy, we walk up to the the drive-through ATM. I did this once when I was a co-op student in Starkville, MS, and got some really, really strange looks.

Drive through ATMs? Never heard about that before. Suppose it makes sense in a drive centric area, but then I only use an ATM once or twice a year and I can walk to it if I need to.

But about the only time I do pay with cash nowadays is a drive through KFC, perhaps they dont trust people to not drive off with their portable pin&chip terminals...

Re: The Crisis in American Walking

#75

Post by BadCookie » Tue, Apr 10, 2012, 7:19 PM UTC

backprojection wrote: post #66

"Carlin Robinson, 12, walks from her grandmother's car to the school bus in Manchester, Ky. Her house can be seen in the background. A study published in 2010, investigating high obesity rates in the town found that residents used cars to minimize walking distance, to the detriment of their health." Association != causation. While the picture this caption is from is indeed ridiculous (grandmother driving her daughter…

One striking thing to me, as someone who spends half my time in San Francisco and half elsewhere, is how much thinner San Franciscans are than most other Americans. Now, it could be because San Franciscans eat less sugar (perhaps because they are wealthier and eat better on the whole). But the Bay Area in general is pretty wealthy, and I think you still see a lot more large people on the peninsula than in SF. The peninsula is much more car dependent. I don't think it's a coincidence, but I can't prove it either.

Re: The Crisis in American Walking

#76

Post by gamble » Tue, Apr 10, 2012, 7:27 PM UTC

hammock wrote: post #18

Duff wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great point. The whole notion of the "gated community" is patently offensive and only possible by virtue of the automobile. Walk through an old city. Even in the victorian era, where families were packed in single rooms with no running water, they were just a 5-10 minute walk from stately townhouses of the well-to-do. Now, we feel the need to separate ourselves with berms and fences.

The upper classes separating themselves from everyone else isn't a modern invention...what do you think castles are?

Ever been inside an actual castle? The lord's family was lucky if they had one or two private rooms. Most castles are tiny compared to their presentation in the media.

Aside from things like 18th-century manor houses - a tiny proportion of any country's population, and absolutely stuffed with working-class servants - the lack of motorized transit meant that upper-class neighbourhoods were usually right in the centre of the city, within walking distance of the poorer areas. You really just have to look at NYC or London to see that. 19th century mansions are not that far from the historically poor areas. And even those people who did own manor houses usually had a townhouse. It wasn't until trains, subways, and automobiles arrived in the mid-20th century that commuting between the business centre and exclusive suburbs became possible.

Re: The Crisis in American Walking

#77

Post by khuey » Tue, Apr 10, 2012, 7:29 PM UTC

_delirium wrote: post #25

MatthewPhillips wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of cities have nice areas around downtown, but few have nice areas around downtown where you can do everything you need (walk to work, walk to the grocery, etc). They do exist, obviously, and some people are more tolerant about walking through a few bad blocks on the way to work than others, but it is my observation that most U.S. cities don't do a good job of making downtown a desirable place to live. Many U.S.…

That's the traditional "business district" style downtown, yeah, but afaict there's been a shift away from that in the past 15-20 years, and now many people commute to downtown in the evenings, because that's where all the restaurants/bars/clubs/theaters are. That's definitely the case in the Bay Area, where SF is much more lively after 5pm than most of the Valley is (Santa Clara is basically dead once office workers…

Parts of the SF financial district are still pretty deserted after around 5/6 PM.

Re: The Crisis in American Walking

#78

Post by Goronmon » Tue, Apr 10, 2012, 7:29 PM UTC

backprojection wrote: post #66

"Carlin Robinson, 12, walks from her grandmother's car to the school bus in Manchester, Ky. Her house can be seen in the background. A study published in 2010, investigating high obesity rates in the town found that residents used cars to minimize walking distance, to the detriment of their health." Association != causation. While the picture this caption is from is indeed ridiculous (grandmother driving her daughter…

Now this is still a controversial topic [5], but my point this kind of explanation seems much stronger and more on-the-mark, than such flaccid ideas like 'americans are getting fat because they don't walk to school anymore'.

I interpreted the article's point is that people avoid any form of physical activity at all cost. One example being driving a child to the end of a driveway instead of letting them walk. If physical activity is essential to maintaining one's health, it seems this sort of decision making would be detrimental to one's health.

I don't see why this is such an awful stance to take.

Re: The Crisis in American Walking

#79

Post by simmons » Tue, Apr 10, 2012, 7:30 PM UTC

jgw wrote: post #38

Sort of related - a funny observation that might amuse Americans about us wacky Canucks: An awful lot of Canadians, myself included, avoid drive-through ATMs, and instead park and walk into the bank. And sometimes, when the bank's busy, we walk up to the the drive-through ATM. I did this once when I was a co-op student in Starkville, MS, and got some really, really strange looks.

My bank's branch in my neighborhood only has a drive-through ATM... and a sign disallowing pedestrians from using it. (A lot of drive-through places have such signs... liability, insurance, etc.) It's annoying. Of course, pedestrians walk up to the drive-through ATM all the time, anyway.

(By the way, I lived in Starkville in my college years, and also had some strange looks as a pedestrian...)

Re: The Crisis in American Walking

#80

Post by dasil003 » Tue, Apr 10, 2012, 7:32 PM UTC

hammock wrote: post #23

Get your Walk Score: http://www.walkscore.com/score/times-square-nyc

I'd like to see it with better UK support. My location near Clapham Junction in London scores an 93, but honestly that's a little low because this is the most insanely walkable place I can imagine. There are probably 300 shops within a quarter-mile radius, I'm two blocks from full on department stores, and there's even a Whole Foods three blocks away which is closer than I ever was to one living in Minneapolis, Santa Fe, and Mountain View (3 of the granolaiest places in America). Bus routes, I dunno, 30+? Rail links, no idea, but there are 18 platforms! Parks? 500 acres within walking distance.