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Apollo astronaut Frank Borman has died

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Apollo astronaut Frank Borman has died

#41

Post by generj »

alephnerd wrote: post #25
jebarker wrote: post #10

I think there are now only eight men still alive that flew to the moon and only four that walked on it. I hope there'll be some still alive to see the next person walk on the moon.

> next person walk on the moon. 2025-2026 if everything goes to plan at NASA The Chinese also announced that they will be attempting to build a lunar base with Russia, Pakistan, Azerbaijan, Venezuela, South Africa, UAE, and Belarus by 2035. I'm curious what JAXA, ESA, and ISRO are going to try with regards to human space flight. I know JAXA and ISRO work very closely with each other, but seem to be much more probe an…

Zero chance Artemis is ready in 2025.

If we are lucky it will be before 2030.

Re: Apollo astronaut Frank Borman has died

#42

Post by Kon-Peki »

lalabert wrote: post #32

Apollo 8 was the greatest of all the Apollo missions. The greatest leap into the unknown with the greatest number of unknowns! For me, Borman and his crewmates never quite got the kudos they deserved. A true loss.

> Borman and his crewmates never quite got the kudos they deserved.

It’s worse than that. Indiana named a horrible stretch of perpetually under construction interstate after him.

Re: Apollo astronaut Frank Borman has died

#43

Post by dotnet00 »

alephnerd wrote: post #25
jebarker wrote: post #10

I think there are now only eight men still alive that flew to the moon and only four that walked on it. I hope there'll be some still alive to see the next person walk on the moon.

> next person walk on the moon. 2025-2026 if everything goes to plan at NASA The Chinese also announced that they will be attempting to build a lunar base with Russia, Pakistan, Azerbaijan, Venezuela, South Africa, UAE, and Belarus by 2035. I'm curious what JAXA, ESA, and ISRO are going to try with regards to human space flight. I know JAXA and ISRO work very closely with each other, but seem to be much more probe an…

2026 will likely be cutting it really close for boots on the Moon. Assuming the upcoming Starship test flight goes well, we might see a test of refueling operations in late 2024, 2 years is likely to be cutting it really close for operationalizing refueling and crew rating the HLS. Particularly on the paperwork front.

I'd say that if everything goes perfectly from this point onwards, 2026 might see the uncrewed test of the system and maybe a crewed landing by 2028.

Similarly with Blue Origin's HLS, maybe New Glenn finally flies in 2024, but they too have so many steps to prove out first. JAXA and ISRO IIRC have seats on a future Artemis crewed mission, which would probably be how they get their first boots on the Moon. ISRO would probably be too busy with its LEO station at that point to make a crewed lunar lander, but JAXA and ISRO would most likely contribute with base components or related (rovers, orbital infrastructure).

The Chinese plans for a lunar base by 2035 are essentially imaginary in terms of partnerships, particularly since of them, China is the only one with any worthwhile space program (the Russian program being in steep decline and would be lucky to even pull off a proper ISS replacement by 2035 let alone a worthwhile contribution to a lunar base).

Re: Apollo astronaut Frank Borman has died

#45

Post by tagami »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #37
lotsofpulp wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would I expect someone to host/write it for free?

I’m somewhat surprised a WikiObituary doesn’t exist yet, with them collectively written and crowdsourced prior to death and licensed permissively. Wikipedia + ChatGPT to do the heavy lifting perhaps for the rough cut, and then clean it up. Might try to find some time to spike a GPT or something and see what happens.

If you're old enough Facebook, becomes this.

Re: Apollo astronaut Frank Borman has died

#46

Post by alephnerd »

khuey wrote: post #36
alephnerd wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> next person walk on the moon. 2025-2026 if everything goes to plan at NASA The Chinese also announced that they will be attempting to build a lunar base with Russia, Pakistan, Azerbaijan, Venezuela, South Africa, UAE, and Belarus by 2035. I'm curious what JAXA, ESA, and ISRO are going to try with regards to human space flight. I know JAXA and ISRO work very closely with each other, but seem to be much more probe an…

JAXA and ESA (among others) are part of the Artemis program's human spaceflight component.

I didn't realize that. NASA really needs to fix their PR department.

Highlighting international cooperation with Japan, UK, Germany, France, etc is a massive PR coup

Edit: they signed the Artemis Accords, not part of the Artemis Program

Re: Apollo astronaut Frank Borman has died

#47

Post by alephnerd »

chihuahua wrote: post #33
alephnerd wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> next person walk on the moon. 2025-2026 if everything goes to plan at NASA The Chinese also announced that they will be attempting to build a lunar base with Russia, Pakistan, Azerbaijan, Venezuela, South Africa, UAE, and Belarus by 2035. I'm curious what JAXA, ESA, and ISRO are going to try with regards to human space flight. I know JAXA and ISRO work very closely with each other, but seem to be much more probe an…

Makes sense; if you want to build a lunar base, you gotta have Venezuela and Azerbaijan on your team, otherwise it's basically futile.

It helps those countries further enhance their own Military R&D (ICBM research often goes hand in hand with Rocket research - that's why India and China started their space programs) while also becoming a PR coup for China+Russia.

Re: Apollo astronaut Frank Borman has died

#48

Post by alephnerd »

dotnet00 wrote: post #43
alephnerd wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> next person walk on the moon. 2025-2026 if everything goes to plan at NASA The Chinese also announced that they will be attempting to build a lunar base with Russia, Pakistan, Azerbaijan, Venezuela, South Africa, UAE, and Belarus by 2035. I'm curious what JAXA, ESA, and ISRO are going to try with regards to human space flight. I know JAXA and ISRO work very closely with each other, but seem to be much more probe an…

2026 will likely be cutting it really close for boots on the Moon. Assuming the upcoming Starship test flight goes well, we might see a test of refueling operations in late 2024, 2 years is likely to be cutting it really close for operationalizing refueling and crew rating the HLS. Particularly on the paperwork front. I'd say that if everything goes perfectly from this point onwards, 2026 might see the uncrewed test…

> the Russian program being in steep decline

Idk.

The Russian program seems to be weaker at operationalizing in 2023 but still has a lot of IP from the USSR era.

China is making massive strides but doesn't seem to have as deep IP experience yet.

Imo I wouldn't oversell the Chinese and undersell the Russians.

> JAXA and ISRO would most likely contribute with base components or related

That tracks, and fits with their specialities.

Also, I didn't realize JAXA, ESA, and ISRO are part of Artemis. NASA needs to have a better PR team. The Chinese Lunar Base is getting so much PR despite being much more behind Artemis

Edit: they signed the Artemis accords, they are not part of the similarly named Artemis Program

Re: Apollo astronaut Frank Borman has died

#49

Post by billforsternz »

Apollo 8 by Jeffrey Kluger is one of my favourite books. It was basically extraordinary that NASA gambled so extravagantly, combining multiple steps in the planned sequence into one mega mission in order to get back on schedule after the disastrous fire and meet Kennedy's aspirational goal. Chances of success? (surviving the mission), maybe 50%.

Thinking about Frank Borman being alive and well and still flying his plane has been a favourite thought for me, and I'm very sad to have to retire it.

Re: Apollo astronaut Frank Borman has died

#50

Post by tahoeskibum »

alephnerd wrote: post #25
jebarker wrote: post #10

I think there are now only eight men still alive that flew to the moon and only four that walked on it. I hope there'll be some still alive to see the next person walk on the moon.

> next person walk on the moon. 2025-2026 if everything goes to plan at NASA The Chinese also announced that they will be attempting to build a lunar base with Russia, Pakistan, Azerbaijan, Venezuela, South Africa, UAE, and Belarus by 2035. I'm curious what JAXA, ESA, and ISRO are going to try with regards to human space flight. I know JAXA and ISRO work very closely with each other, but seem to be much more probe an…

Aren't JAXA, ESA and ISRO part of the Artemis Accords? ISRO has human spaceflight planned for 2024.
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