The law just needs to be: You can be the platform or you can be on the platform, but not both.
Same should go for internet.
You can own the infrastructure or you can provide the service, but not both.
Brits make Amazon, Meta stop using third-party data to undercut rivals
31–40 of 59 posts
Re: Brits make Amazon, Meta stop using third-party data to undercut rivals
#32Dumb government. Higher prices and less variety for you. Why can’t they just let adults buy and sell the way they want to?
Why can’t they just let adults buy and sell the way they want to? Would be nice but Amazon are quite keen on not letting that happen.
How’s that? Amazon is lobbying for legislation to prevent you from purchasing from someone?
Re: Brits make Amazon, Meta stop using third-party data to undercut rivals
#33Dumb government. Higher prices and less variety for you. Why can’t they just let adults buy and sell the way they want to?
> Why can’t they just let adults buy and sell the way they want to? Perhaps we should all go and (re-)read the history of Standard Oil just to refresh our memories of what it looks like if we were to let that happen? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Oil_Co._of_New_Jersey... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Successors_of_Standard_Oil
You’re arguing that govt action in 1911 effectively alleviated oil and gas industry influence on the economy and politics?
Why then did John D Rockefeller (correctly) advise “buy Standard Oil stock” on hearing the news? https://www.nytimes.com/1998/05/20/business/us-v-microsoft-t...
Re: Brits make Amazon, Meta stop using third-party data to undercut rivals
#34The law just needs to be: You can be the platform or you can be on the platform, but not both.
Same should go for internet. You can own the infrastructure or you can provide the service, but not both.
The distinction between platform and product is much hazier in software compared to physical industries.
For example, it’s taken for granted that most personal computing platforms have built in PDF viewers, but this wasn’t always the case and used to be a distinct product category (and still is to some extent). Similar for media players, some networking software, and spreadsheet apps.
Should Cloudflare be allowed to offer reverse CDN services for uploading content? Or would that unfairly compete with companies like Mux?
(Entertaining the notion that Mux is built on CF)
Re: Brits make Amazon, Meta stop using third-party data to undercut rivals
#35Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yup. A complete ban on in-house brands for anyone operating a marketplace.
Including grocery stores?
I love this question. Supposedly, Walmart does a significant amount of profit from their house brand which is, inspired by their suppliers in a similar way to Amazon.
As a Costco shopper, I am also quite likely to grab the Kirkland brand instead of the competitor.
Re: Brits make Amazon, Meta stop using third-party data to undercut rivals
#36So basically, Amazon is not allowed to look at what products are selling well on Amazon before they decide which products to make. However, Amazon is still allowed to sell products, and presumably market research firms are going to give them the same results, more or less. So what did this accomplish, really? It seems like some UK lawmaker is up for reelection and wants a feather in their cap.
It strikes me as very similar to the ever present conflict of interest in the securities world between clients and broker-dealers. A business like Amazon’s retail one is quite like the latter, and I would be totally unsurprised to see more and more legislative pressure applied to force them to segregate if not choose between their ‘agency’ and ‘prop’-type franchises; especially outside the US. Stuff like the EU’s DMA…
We let supermarkets competitively position themselves all the time. Why is Amazon different?
Re: Brits make Amazon, Meta stop using third-party data to undercut rivals
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
Same should go for internet. You can own the infrastructure or you can provide the service, but not both.
The distinction between platform and product is much hazier in software compared to physical industries. For example, it’s taken for granted that most personal computing platforms have built in PDF viewers, but this wasn’t always the case and used to be a distinct product category (and still is to some extent). Similar for media players, some networking software, and spreadsheet apps. Should Cloudflare be allowed to…
This doesn’t appear to be a response to or at all related to ISPs either owning the infrastructure or selling the service. What exactly is your point about ISPs here?
Re: Brits make Amazon, Meta stop using third-party data to undercut rivals
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
It strikes me as very similar to the ever present conflict of interest in the securities world between clients and broker-dealers. A business like Amazon’s retail one is quite like the latter, and I would be totally unsurprised to see more and more legislative pressure applied to force them to segregate if not choose between their ‘agency’ and ‘prop’-type franchises; especially outside the US. Stuff like the EU’s DMA…
We let supermarkets competitively position themselves all the time. Why is Amazon different?
Well, actually, I think this is increasingly being highlighted as a problem.
For example a few years ago in Australia it was a big issue that the supermarket duopoly was intentially making their brands of milk too cheap. There was a kind of spiral where expensive brands weren't selling well, so farmers had to sign restrictive contracts with the big supermarkets, but the rates were too low to be profitable or even viable.
The conflict of interest sort of "broke" the free market for milk. I'm not sure if retailers should be forced to be "brokers or producers but not both" but I am sure that if they were purely "brokers" then we wouldn't have experienced this particular problem. (The fact that the supermaket business is so centralised is another related issue).
Re: Brits make Amazon, Meta stop using third-party data to undercut rivals
#39Re: Brits make Amazon, Meta stop using third-party data to undercut rivals
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, yes, and that's not some circumvention of measures like this, but the intent of these sorts of anti-competitive laws. Amazon can use the same data they've been using all this time, but they must not put themselves in a special position in acquiring that data. If they want to publish their sales data for free or for a price that they themselves pay, that's fine, as long as others can also get the data.
Wouldn't selling it, perhaps not be particularly fair. Like, couldn't they sell it at a price that would eat up all potential profits from the company using the data. But it'd be fine since they could run that segment of the company at a loss to bolster profits in other parts of the company?
They'd have to sell the data to a third party, who would only be willing to pay market rates (they'd profit more from reselling that data to multiple parties).
Colluding to increase the base rate would be a kind of price fixing (i.e. illegal) and having the third party increase the margin wouldn't benefit Amazon at all.
EDIT: remember if the data is actually valuable, then Amazon could sell it for MORE than it costs to buy it back, since the third party can recoup its costs from multiple purchasers. (So the market mechnism helps make the data more accessible and broadly useful.)