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Sam Bankman-Fried Convicted

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Re: Sam Bankman-Fried Convicted

#971
post #890

[flagged]

Out of interest did you make the same arguments about Martin Shkreli (arrogant and unlikable child of immigrants who did a much smaller scale scam similar to SBFs but where everyone was eventually repaid in full) and about Andrew Auernheimer (annoying and racist child of a working class single mother who performed a fairly successful hack without any personal gain) and about Brian Salcedo (working class, non-college-…

Andrew Auernheimer here.

Though I was unjustly convicted under false pretenses by federal prosecutors willing to lie and misrepresent the law and my rights were deeply violated, having been to prison in the process I found it filled with quite a large number of people who absolutely should be there. One drug dealer, for example, laughed about forcing a desperate woman to fuck his dog for dope. There were also a pair of twins that tried to acquire a toddler for use as a sex slave.

There were also some people that shouldn't have been there, perhaps not put in prison on false charges like me, but taking years off their life was a basic injustice that did nothing to advance society and likely encouraged further criminality.

All nice and stable societies have long-term incarceration. Japan has notoriously hard prisons, even worse than most federal facilities in the United States. If I could, I would change how the prisons worked and treated their prisoners. I would definitely segregate off some of the categories of prisoners from others, and we surely have enough facilities to do so. But without the ability to denaturalize people and permanently expel them to a prison colony, you are going to need large numbers of people in longterm confinement. I'd say society would be much better off if half the prisoners I met never walked free, and a quarter were never incarcerated in the first place. The US justice system has 3 major problems: it convicts too many people, lets the wrong people avoid prison, and has too many people given kid glove sentences who really should go down for a lot longer. Even having been falsely convicted and tortured by the United States, I am not so foolish as to believe in prison abolition.

Re: Sam Bankman-Fried Convicted

#973

[flagged]

> Wouldn't a lifetime ban on all white-collar work suffice?

I think putting him to work until he pays off every stolen dollar would suffice. Making minimum wage stamping license place, it should only take him ~540,906 years[1] of work to pay off his debt to society.

The guy's admitted no fault, no remorse, and kept trying to do the slick-conman-swindle in front of the judge and jury. He's learned no lessons, and we're all better off without having to worry about predators like him.

If you can get 2 years for stealing a car, this seems reasonable.

[1] With weekends, but no holidays.

Re: Sam Bankman-Fried Convicted

#974

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there really is such a thing as a person with a lot of book-learning but less common sense than a sea slug I don't even think SBF had the book-learning, just intellectual arrogance. "I don’t want to say no book is ever worth reading, but I actually do believe something pretty close to that. I think, if you wrote a book, you f---ed up, and it should have been a six-paragraph blog post."

The craziest thing to me is that when he was saying things like that noone in the mainstream media was questioning him. The FT had a very flattering lunch interview with him shortly before his demise. It was embarrassing how they were portraying him.

Think that's crazy? Read what HN commenters were saying about FTX before the collapse. There were skeptics, for sure. But plenty of people here who thought sam was smart, good at business, and more prudent and above board than other crypto CEOs. Many users here have a blindspot when it comes to detecting bullshit. Sam reminded us of ourselves, so we believed him.

Re: Sam Bankman-Fried Convicted

#975

Remember: this is not a cryptocurrency problem, it's a banking problem. This guy created a literal bank. People deposited funds in it. Instead of simply being a custodian, he took the money and "invested" it. And lost it all. I wish this sort of thing would happen every time bankers screwed things up. Instead the government bails them out.

No, it was also a cryptocurrency problem:

1. FTX got away with this for so long, in part because they weren't subject to the auditing and scrutiny of traditional finance.

2. Volatile crypto prices exacerbated the issues caused by alameda's borrowing.

3. Sam could pretend that FTX had more assets than it really did thanks to FTT, a crypto coin with no inherent value, and an artificially inflated price.

This was a banking problem, sure. But most banks didn't have this problem. The manipulated nature of cryptocurrency markets and the legal gray area it operates in facilitated this scam.

Re: Sam Bankman-Fried Convicted

#977

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair SBF convicted himself on a platter. Only he knows what made him think he'd get away by facing trial. Maybe he was just dumb, overconfident, ill-advised, or a combination of everything.

He is one of those people who think they can talk their way out of everything. Everything is not only negotiable, but the only possible "truth" is what they are saying right now (yesterday's "truth"? "You're remembering that incorrectly - I never said that!" ). I hated working for people like that, and I'd feel like I needed to take a shower after every meeting. If you only encounter them occasionally, a normal perso…

It's not really a "thing people do", more "how their ChatGPT works". Holding consistent state over a long time period is pretty advanced brain stuff. E.g. mice and even monkeys don't need that capability much. We delude ourselves into believing that human brains have filesystem-level persistence, but really they don't. SBF is just a bit more sigma from the mean.

Re: Sam Bankman-Fried Convicted

#979
post #834

[flagged]

I certainly don’t like the revenge/punishment philosophy of jail, but I think the system should be fixed for everyone (make it truly about rehab when possible, and about protecting society when not possible), but what you propose would only make an unfair system even more unfair. Why should he get off without jail and someone who breaks into a car and comparatively steals pocket change end up in jail? Not to mention…

If an impoverished criminal with no education attains affluence solely from their crimes, would the background still factor into the punishment that you give them?
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