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Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

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Re: Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

#11

Young people don't want to work hard because there's little incentive. No matter how hard you work, unless you're in the top 5%, you're far priced out of most places most people want to live. You can afford everything comfortably beside housing & health care (which you don't need much of when you're young) on a relatively low wage in the US. So you've pretty much given up on housing. What's the point in working hard?

Damn, I can't even afford healthcare at my current wage in digital marketing. The plans I've found would take up about 10% of my yearly income and I'm late-20's, healthy, no pre-existing, non-smoker, etc.

Even with that, the pay is barely enough to qualify me for my apartment, which is artificially low in rent since I moved in during peak COVID and have had low rent increases.

Re: Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

#12
Moving back to the US after living abroad I was used to month long holidays. I applied to a few companies and tried to negotiate 5 weeks PTO. They wouldn't budge. Then 4 weeks. Still no. I offered to drop my salary in exchange for vacation. Still no. I asked HR why everything else was negotiable except PTO and they told me I would have more time off then people who've been there for 7+ years.

This was my first clue that there was a lot of momentum to keep you dependent on your employer and it doesn't stop with a paycheck. 10-12 days per year really restricts your mobility. Instead of backpacking through SE Asia for a month I basically used that time for Thanksgiving and/or Christmas.

BTW, having 3 days off means you can sprinkle on additional vacation time throughout the year. I'm not surprised Gen-Z would negotiate less vacation time if they could use it more effectively.

Re: Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

#13
[…]

> Now it is true that the needs of human beings may seem to be insatiable. But they fall into two classes --those needs which are absolute in the sense that we feel them whatever the situation of our fellow human beings may be, and those which are relative in the sense that we feel them only if their satisfaction lifts us above, makes us feel superior to, our fellows. Needs of the second class, those which satisfy the desire for superiority, may indeed be insatiable; for the higher the general level, the higher still are they. But this is not so true of the absolute needs-a point may soon be reached, much sooner perhaps than we are all of us aware of, when these needs are satisfied in the sense that we prefer to devote our further energies to non-economic purposes.

[…]

> For many ages to come the old Adam will be so strong in us that everybody will need to do some work if he is to be contented. We shall do more things for ourselves than is usual with the rich to-day, only too glad to have small duties and tasks and routines. But beyond this, we shall endeavour to spread the bread thin on the butter-to make what work there is still to be done to be as widely shared as possible. Three-hour shifts or a fifteen-hour week may put off the problem for a great while. For three hours a day is quite enough to satisfy the old Adam in most of us!

* John Maynard Keynes, Economic Possibilities for our Grandchildren (1930)

* http://www.econ.yale.edu/smith/econ116a/keynes1.pdf

An essay putting forward / hypothesizing four reasons on why the above did not happen (We haven't spread the wealth around enough; People actually love working; There's no limit to human desires; Leisure is expensive):

* https://www.vox.com/2014/11/20/7254877/keynes-work-leisure

Re: Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

#14

Young people don't want to work hard because there's little incentive. No matter how hard you work, unless you're in the top 5%, you're far priced out of most places most people want to live. You can afford everything comfortably beside housing & health care (which you don't need much of when you're young) on a relatively low wage in the US. So you've pretty much given up on housing. What's the point in working hard?

The Ants and the Grasshopper - Aesop

https://read.gov/aesop/052.html

Re: Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

#15

I took a $50k job in my late 20s just for full remote with no calls/meetings, just Github issues and a chat app for synchronization. I felt pathetic accepting the offer especially after my counteroffer was rejected (imagine your bluff failing here, lmao), but I remembered sitting in meetings for a higher paying job fantasizing about how I'd give half my salary away just to have no meetings and living on a beach surfi…

Was it worth it? How'd they keep their commitment to no calls/meetings? I'd be worried about the employer reneging on that.

Re: Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

#16

One way to think about it is that you’re getting a 20% pay bump. It’s not 1:1 exactly but I’m willing to bet a lot of people would trade certain perks for a 20% bump. But it’s a net loss for society to remove these perks. Being young means you don’t need these perks. You don’t give a damn about healthcare, child care, or life insurance. But you most likely will in a decade and getting it back these perks would be nea…

I'm willing to bet people with a 4 day week need their health insurance way less. (on average)

Re: Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

#17
post #2

Source for the article: “Younger workers want a 4-day workweek — and some would give up remote work or higher pay for it” https://www.bankrate.com/personal-finance/younger-workers-wa... > Close to 8 in 10 Gen X and baby boomer workers (or 78 percent for those between the ages of 43 and 77 combined) support a four-day workweek. > But younger workers indicate they’re willing to go to greater lengths for the schedule, a…

The title makes it sound like they'd sacrifice allot but when you look at the percentages it's mostly just I'd like to work 4-10s.

The happiest stint of my career was working steady 4-10s. So yeah, I fully support the idea.

Re: Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

#18
post #2

Source for the article: “Younger workers want a 4-day workweek — and some would give up remote work or higher pay for it” https://www.bankrate.com/personal-finance/younger-workers-wa... > Close to 8 in 10 Gen X and baby boomer workers (or 78 percent for those between the ages of 43 and 77 combined) support a four-day workweek. > But younger workers indicate they’re willing to go to greater lengths for the schedule, a…

The title makes it sound like they'd sacrifice allot but when you look at the percentages it's mostly just I'd like to work 4-10s.

Which is interesting, because I feel like I'm lucky when I have the focus to do even 4 hours of high intensity, cognitively demanding work in a day. Much of the rest of that day is fluffing around, meetings or doing stuff that seems like it could probably be delegated or automated with the right setup.

Re: Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

#19

Young people don't want to work hard because there's little incentive. No matter how hard you work, unless you're in the top 5%, you're far priced out of most places most people want to live. You can afford everything comfortably beside housing & health care (which you don't need much of when you're young) on a relatively low wage in the US. So you've pretty much given up on housing. What's the point in working hard?

I keep hearing this but home ownership percentage is comparable to past generations when you actually look at the data.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/RHORUSQ156N

Also gen z has surpassed millennials and genx in home ownership (with comparable timing).

""In 2022, 30% of 25-year-olds owned a home. At the same age 28% of millennials, and 27% of Gen Xers owned homes, according to real estate brokerage, Redfin.""

https://www.marketplace.org/2023/09/14/how-are-gen-zers-buyi...

Im more inclined to believe the lazy mentality is from lifestyle and cultural stemming. Its cool to not care or try. And according to instagram if you're not a millionaire by age 25 then you're a loser. So why even try?

That being said I see nothing wrong with a 4 day work week.

Re: Young people would sacrifice other perks for a 4-day workweek

#20
post #14

Young people don't want to work hard because there's little incentive. No matter how hard you work, unless you're in the top 5%, you're far priced out of most places most people want to live. You can afford everything comfortably beside housing & health care (which you don't need much of when you're young) on a relatively low wage in the US. So you've pretty much given up on housing. What's the point in working hard?

The Ants and the Grasshopper - Aesop https://read.gov/aesop/052.html

Obviously irrelevant
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