151–160 of 183 posts
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One hour 4K Netflix episode would be around 1Gb magnitude and likely watched by even more than 1M ppl. Game downloads even bigger, often at several Gb, with similar amount of users. Though not everyone is Netflix.
Almost no one is
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Author here and it is true that costs within a region are free and if you do design your system appropriately you can take advantage of it but I've seen accidental cases where someone will try to access in another region and it's nice to not even have to worry about it. Even that can be handled with better tooling/processes but the bigger point is if you want to have your data be available across clouds to take advan…
Yeah, for greenfield work building up on R2 is generally a far better deal than S3, but if you have a massive amount of data already on S3, especially if it's small files, you're going to pay a massive penalty to move the data. Sippy is nice but it just spreads the pain over time.
That egress money was going to be spent with or without sippy. It's not "just spreading" the pain, it's avoiding adding any pain at all.
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What are the economics that Amazon and other providers have egress fees and R2 doesn't? Is it acting as a loss leader or does this model still make money for CloudFlare?
Greed on the cloud providers part, I think. You'd expect egress fees to enable cheaper compute, but there are other cloud providers out there like Hetzner with cheaper compute and egress, so the economics don't really add up.
I used the storage box from hetzner before but they only had 1TB or 5TB (and higher) choices so I had to pay for 5TB (€12 per month) without using most of it. Having rsync support was nice but rclone works fine with S3.
Here’s a tweet from Corey Quinn describing how bonkers R2 pricing is: > let’s remember that the internet is 1-to-many. If 1 million people download that 1GB this month, my cost with @cloudflare R2 this way rounds up to 13¢. With @awscloud S3 it’s $59,247.52. https://x.com/quinnypig/status/1443076111651401731?s=46
To be fair, 1 million downloads @ 1GB is a lot of data transfer. CloudFlare is likely losing money on this.
I feel R2 should charge something for transfer though, otherwise people could abuse it. Hetzner charges ~1.5% of AWS egress fees which I feel is right thing to do and likely profitable.
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1. This is the most obvious one, but S3 access control is done via IAM. For better or for worse, IAM has a lot of functionality. I can configure a specific EC2 instance to have access to a specific file in S3 without the need to deal with API keys and such. I can search CloudTrail for all the times a specific user read a certain file. 2. R2 doesn't support file versioning like S3. As I understand it, Wasabi supports…
Thank you for providing product roadmap. Label all the above: coming soon.
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What are the economics that Amazon and other providers have egress fees and R2 doesn't? Is it acting as a loss leader or does this model still make money for CloudFlare?
I’m inherently suspicious of services that are free (like Cloudflare egress). Maybe I’ve been burned too many times over the years, but I almost expect some kind of hostility or u-turn in the long run (I do really like Cloudflare’s products right now!). I almost wish they had some kind of sustainable usage-based charge that was much lower than AWS. Feel free to tell me why I’m wrong! I’d love to jump onboard - it jus…
There probably needs to be an abuse prevention rate limit (and probably is), but it's not quite as crazy as it sounds to just rely on their CDN bandwidth sharing policies instead of charging.
There are some dealbreakers to me. 1. No Object history and locking. So there is absolutely no way to recover files when you do any kinds of mistakes. 2. No object tiering and storage is not that cheap. Although R2 egress is free, R2 is only 35% cheaper than S3 in terms of storage, but it is not cheaper than other alternatives. Furthermore, R2 is a lot more expensive than S3 infrequent/cold tier. For example, Backbla…
Next up: moving our cloud edge (NAT Gateways, WAF, etc) to Fortinet appliances, which licenses we purchased bundled with our on-prem infra.
I know Corey Quinn always harps on AWS' egress pricing but you really can't emphasize it enough: it's literally extortionary!