Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education • Hacker News Board

Re: Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education

#411

Post by ryandrake » Tue, Oct 31, 2023, 9:04 PM UTC

marcusverus wrote: post #283

haizhung wrote: post #261

Am I the only one thinking that home schooling is the wrong solution to the underlying problem? The problem is that the public education sector has been - for years - continuously squeezed dry of any funding. Teachers are quitting left and right, and schools are in a terrible state. Instead of fixing THAT problem, now people homeschool. Ok; I guess. At least homeschooling is something that the individual can control,…

> The problem is that the public education sector has been - for years - continuously squeezed dry of any funding. Public school spending in the US is up almost 50% in the last 30 years.[0] https://www.statista.com/statistics/203118/expenditures-per-...

Where's all that money going? Surely not to teachers who are chronically underpaid and have 30+ students per class. It's not buying school supplies, which our teachers often have to pay for out of pocket or hold bake sales to fund.

Is it all going to football fields, useless technology spending, and 5 levels of non-teaching administration staff?

Re: Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education

#412

Post by pastage » Tue, Oct 31, 2023, 9:04 PM UTC

anon291 wrote: post #341

FireBeyond wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Beyond that, there are parents who are well equipped to homeschool and parents who are not. And there is a small but hard-to-ignore percentage who claim to homeschool but really neglect their kids. There's such a disparity between states. States like mine require homeschooled kids to occasionally attend actual school for check in or certain classes, and participate in the same testing (regardless of your opinion of…

> Texas is working on an amendment that ostensibly cuts taxes on child care facilities to make them more affordable. It's very easy to tell that those savings won't be passed on to consumers. In reality, it's very much more a pro-homeschooling thing. "Homeschool your kids and save on your property taxes". A 'childcare facility' typically refers to something kids go to before school. I've noticed several other comment…

It has not been normal to spend workdays with your three year old around here for ages. At 1-3 years most if not all children go to kindergarten.

Re: Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education

#413

Post by escapedmoose » Tue, Oct 31, 2023, 9:05 PM UTC

Amezarak wrote: post #23

CharlesW wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are many home-schooling success stories, and also many home-schooling horror stories. https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2020/05/law-school-pr...

Similarly, there are many public school horror stories. For example, despite spending $21k/student, making it the third-highest funded school system in the country, 23 Baltimore schools failed to produce a single student with basic math proficiency.[1] One of my friends went to a school where she was beaten every day and the teachers had totally given up and most of them did not teach. Unfortunately, we need much mor…

Baltimore’s government has been corrupt af for years for some reason or another. In this circumstance, they should be treated as an outlier imo

Re: Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education

#414

Post by AlexandrB » Tue, Oct 31, 2023, 9:06 PM UTC

marcusverus wrote: post #283

haizhung wrote: post #261

Am I the only one thinking that home schooling is the wrong solution to the underlying problem? The problem is that the public education sector has been - for years - continuously squeezed dry of any funding. Teachers are quitting left and right, and schools are in a terrible state. Instead of fixing THAT problem, now people homeschool. Ok; I guess. At least homeschooling is something that the individual can control,…

> The problem is that the public education sector has been - for years - continuously squeezed dry of any funding. Public school spending in the US is up almost 50% in the last 30 years.[0] https://www.statista.com/statistics/203118/expenditures-per-...

Where the hell is all this money going? It's certainly not to teachers, whose salaries have barely changed[1] when adjusted for inflation. Is it going to real estate costs? Technology costs? Administration? What?

[1] https://www.statista.com/chart/20979/public-school-teacher-s...

Re: Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education

#415

Post by arcbyte » Tue, Oct 31, 2023, 9:09 PM UTC

drw3 wrote: post #361

xyzelement wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

// other aspects of homeschooling were just a fig leaf over a whole lot of religious indoctrination I was raised totally secular but I now understand that religion is about fundamentally aligning yourself to the highest aspirations ("what kind of man does G-d want me to be?") and even w/o actual faith, I am starting to think that's preferable to the current mode of "anything goes, you can be whatever you feel like an…

[deleted]

Interestingly you're having the same experience as the person you are replying to, but you haven't reached the understanding they've reached.

If all those people you say refuse to question their beliefs are actually chasing a higher form of good for themselves, why would they engage in any kind of activity that would undermine that pursuit? It doesn't make sense unless you propose to replace it with a structure that is more strongly aligned to with the goal of achieving a higher form of themselves. Which nobody ever actually is when they argue against religion, they just got hurt by somebody's interpretation of it and are trying to find validation for that hurt.

Re: Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education

#416

Post by gnicholas » Tue, Oct 31, 2023, 9:09 PM UTC

ken47 wrote: post #228

Titles like this irk me. It’s likely the fastest growing because it’s fringe.

The graphics don't help clear things up, either. Showing the growth rate over time is interesting, but only if you also show the percent of kids in each camp. It's not immediately obvious whether homeschooled kids are 2%, 8%, or .2%, from looking at the charts (and even doing a ctrl-F on "percent").

It's kind of embarrassing that this article doesn't once mention the rough percentage of students that are being homeschooled.

Re: Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education

#417

Post by bigstrat2003 » Tue, Oct 31, 2023, 9:09 PM UTC

drw3 wrote: post #361

xyzelement wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

// other aspects of homeschooling were just a fig leaf over a whole lot of religious indoctrination I was raised totally secular but I now understand that religion is about fundamentally aligning yourself to the highest aspirations ("what kind of man does G-d want me to be?") and even w/o actual faith, I am starting to think that's preferable to the current mode of "anything goes, you can be whatever you feel like an…

[deleted]

> I know you just said “religion,” but I can only speak about Christianity as I’m deeply familiar with it.

I believe you when you speak of the bad experiences you had, but you seem to think that what you've seen is the only (or at least the typical) manifestation of Christianity. But that isn't true, and if you do indeed believe it's true I respectfully suggest you aren't deeply familiar with Christianity the way you believe.

I am a Christian, and I was raised Christian. I have never once seen a community such as you describe. I realize they exist (everyone knows about the WBC, for instance), but they aren't the norm. Christians I have known aren't trying to indoctrinate anyone, and they are quite happy to entertain respectful discussion and debate about their faith. They are only human, of course, and like all humans they don't wish to constantly debate things they settled for themselves ages ago (so you are sometimes going to get individuals who shut you down). But on the whole Christians are perfectly willing to engage in introspection or intellectual debate to the same extent anyone else is (because let's not forget, many people don't do introspection or intellectual debate of any topic).

> It’s slowly dying in every developed country because it doesn’t make sense when logic and science are applied.

You are welcome to your opinion, but it stands at odds with the fact that there have been many Christian intellectuals throughout history. Scientists, theologians, and philosophers have all found that their faith still makes perfect sense in the context of their intellectual pursuits.

Re: Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education

#418

Post by Exoristos » Tue, Oct 31, 2023, 9:10 PM UTC

tivert wrote: post #15

> Many of America’s new home-schooled children have entered a world where no government official will ever check on what, or how well, they are being taught. Isn't escaping from those officials the whole point? Either because they're failing at their job or doing things that are disagreeable to some subset of the population?

For some, that may be true. For others, it's a replacement for private school that they can't afford.

Re: Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education

#419

Post by robertlagrant » Tue, Oct 31, 2023, 9:12 PM UTC

drw3 wrote: post #361

xyzelement wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

// other aspects of homeschooling were just a fig leaf over a whole lot of religious indoctrination I was raised totally secular but I now understand that religion is about fundamentally aligning yourself to the highest aspirations ("what kind of man does G-d want me to be?") and even w/o actual faith, I am starting to think that's preferable to the current mode of "anything goes, you can be whatever you feel like an…

[deleted]

> That’s what religious people want you to believe, but if you watch how they act, how they vote, and how they discriminate it could not be farther from the truth.

While your deep understanding of a few people around you is your own, Christianity alone has over a billion people from all cultures and walks of life ascribing to it. I don't think you can realistically claim to treat them as a bloc, and to attempt to might cast doubt on your ability to even judge well the people you do know.

Re: Home schooling's rise from fringe to fastest-growing form of education

#420

Post by s1artibartfast » Tue, Oct 31, 2023, 9:13 PM UTC

cycomanic wrote: post #178

akira2501 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The underlying problem is the completely unregulated nature. I didn't need your permission to give birth to my children, why do I need your permission when deciding how I educate them? > Only dad is allowed to talk to anyone and when he does it's extraordinarily weird. If you feel these children are legitimately being abused in some way, I'm guessing there are plenty of state resources to address that challenge. Do…

> > The underlying problem is the completely unregulated nature. > I didn't need your permission to give birth to my children, why do I need your permission when deciding how I educate them? Because your children are not your property, they are your responsibility and we as society have decided that we want to make sure that the education is to a certain standard. As a side note I find it fascinating how people who f…

I think I can explain the confusution.

The state dictating and setting the rules is no more free than the parents setting the rules.

This basically comes down to an argument not of freedom, but if the children are property of the state or parents.

When you look at it this way, it makes perfect sense that libertairian minded folks would support homeschooling.

After all, the state isnt offering the freedom of choice and action to children, it is making legal requirements and demands.