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Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

robkhenderson.com

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Re: Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

#61

Post by lifeisstillgood »

I am not clear why this is flagged but it seems pretty on point academic-blog for a US university (hey look, there are class issues in society ! who knew!)

I think the idea of luxury beliefs is a fairly good descriptor for what the .5% will need. Once you start looking there are many examples - how many high flyers do you know that have taken up ultra-marathons (very time consuming) or charity work as an all but obligatory percentage of time.

It's a marker for "I have family life so locked down that I can attend to these other expensive options and not be overwhelmed.

Re: Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

#62

Post by mrangle »

tech_ken wrote: post #50
mrangle wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They aren't speaking about protest in the interest of the human rights of Palestinians. See the fact that protestors aren't suggesting that Hamas give themselves up as a means of protecting the lives of their Palestinian human shields. Protestors want October 7th and no consequences, or limited consequences on the terms of those who would see the perpetrators keep power. Specifically, to be able to slaughter masses o…

Not all protests exist to further concrete political proposals (ex. suggestions to Hamas). Expressions of mass grief, community solidarity, and elevation of an issue which harms your neighbors are all important outcomes for people meeting en masse. You're welcome to impute whatever motives you want onto people you disagree with, but that doesn't mean you actually understand.

And the lying about the nature of "Palestinian support" continues. In spite of the protest-wide evidence at virtually every demonstration.

Re: Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

#63

Post by [deleted] »

mrangle wrote: post #62
tech_ken wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all protests exist to further concrete political proposals (ex. suggestions to Hamas). Expressions of mass grief, community solidarity, and elevation of an issue which harms your neighbors are all important outcomes for people meeting en masse. You're welcome to impute whatever motives you want onto people you disagree with, but that doesn't mean you actually understand.

And the lying about the nature of "Palestinian support" continues. In spite of the protest-wide evidence at virtually every demonstration.

[deleted]

Re: Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

#64

Post by giraffe_lady »

anon291 wrote: post #58
giraffe_lady wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK. I mean if you're not curious about it I'm not going to try to convince you? Generations of activists and scholars have found a relationship here but if you're certain they're wrong to that's your project. Not sure why you even wrote anything past the first sentence here.

> I mean if you're not curious about it I'm not going to try to convince you? With that attitude it's no surprised both groups have become -- as they say -- marginalized.

mmm

Re: Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

#65

Post by mindslight »

Of course there is some truth in here. But the sheer majority is missing the forest for the trees.

Luxury beliefs are certainly products of wealth - it requires a level of wealth to declare something is wrong rather than pragmatically keeping your head down and going with the flow. As our society becomes more wealthy, these beliefs gain mindshare and become widely accepted - democracy, natural rights, freedom from religion, worker protections, etc.

These things are products of wealth, a type of wealth in their own right, and we should be greatful that our society has become wealthy enough to declare that they should be universal. The author kind of references this at the very end, but then steers right back into the regressive fundamentalism as his closing conclusion.

Looking forward, many visions of progress are somewhat wrong, misguided, or at the very least overstated. Remember when we were all going to be living in Buckyballs? Which is why you have to kind of hold your nose to wade through much of the blue tribe groupthink. But the answer isn't to conclude the entire idea of progress is fallacious and dopamine-pine for the glory days of hard work that are comfortably in the past. Rather, it's to discuss and critique the forward-looking ideas on their own merits, despite the neo-clergy and other politickers that will attack you for it.

Re: Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

#66

Post by AnimalMuppet »

leereeves wrote: post #27
chancemehmu wrote: post #6

Reminds me of one of my favourite quotes by Huxley: "If you’re to do anything reasonable in this world, you must have a class of people who are secure, safe from public opinion, safe from poverty, leisured, not compelled to waste their time in the imbecile routines that go by the name of Honest Work. You must have a class of which the members can think and, within the obvious limits, do what they please. You must hav…

It sounds like you're talking about an aristocracy, and the quote even uses that word, so I wonder: do you think the aristocracy is responsible for most of the progress in the world? I'd argue rather that, historically, progress has generally involved removing or disempowering the aristocracy.

In Huxley's day, that was more true[1] than it is today. Look at someone like Lord Kelvin, for instance. State-sponsored science wasn't really a thing yet; most of it was done by people who had the time and money to pursue it.

[1] That is, it was true of scientific progress. As you say, social progress often involved finding a way to destroy the aristocracy's stranglehold on money and power.

Re: Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

#67

Post by tech_ken »

mrangle wrote: post #62
tech_ken wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all protests exist to further concrete political proposals (ex. suggestions to Hamas). Expressions of mass grief, community solidarity, and elevation of an issue which harms your neighbors are all important outcomes for people meeting en masse. You're welcome to impute whatever motives you want onto people you disagree with, but that doesn't mean you actually understand.

And the lying about the nature of "Palestinian support" continues. In spite of the protest-wide evidence at virtually every demonstration.

I suppose if I equate “retributive genocide” and “just consequences” then I can see where you’re coming from. The US made similar statements as they poured white phosphorus on Afghani children after 9/11 and I thought it was a thin argument then. I don’t find it much more convincing now.

Overall I try not to lie, but given how different our experiences seem to be I’m not sure if there’s much I can say on the internet to convince you of that. Have a good one!

Re: Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

#68

Post by less_less »

mc32 wrote: post #57
michaelmrose wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Few cities reduced police budgets at all certainly nobody in any meaningful way defunded the police and even cities short of officers have funding for additional officers they lack people far more than money. Also in case you didn't notice police don't do much to protect normal folks from crime. They'll be there 15 minutes after whatever happened happened to file a report if they aren't too busy screwing with law abi…

The movement not only affected budgets but also affected morale. DAs would not press charges, so they didn’t bother with lesser crimes. Yes, the police harass, sometimes I get harassed but that presence is what puts a lid on crime. I’ll put up with some harassment in exchange for fewer criminals running free. We can seek redress from the police, we cannot seek redress from criminals. The reason we need police is the…

> Yes, the police harass, sometimes I get harassed but that presence is what puts a lid on crime.

> I’ll put up with some harassment in exchange for fewer criminals running free.

Maybe you have a specific harassment:imprisonment ratio in mind, but to me this just says "bring on the police state".

> We can seek redress from the police, we cannot seek redress from criminals.

You can seek it, unless of course they kill you. But will you actually find it? Police departments are famous for investigating themselves and finding that they did nothing wrong.

Re: Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

#69

Post by mc32 »

less_less wrote: post #68
mc32 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The movement not only affected budgets but also affected morale. DAs would not press charges, so they didn’t bother with lesser crimes. Yes, the police harass, sometimes I get harassed but that presence is what puts a lid on crime. I’ll put up with some harassment in exchange for fewer criminals running free. We can seek redress from the police, we cannot seek redress from criminals. The reason we need police is the…

> Yes, the police harass, sometimes I get harassed but that presence is what puts a lid on crime. > I’ll put up with some harassment in exchange for fewer criminals running free. Maybe you have a specific harassment:imprisonment ratio in mind, but to me this just says "bring on the police state". > We can seek redress from the police, we cannot seek redress from criminals. You can seek it, unless of course they kill…

Compared to the alternative? I'll take the lesser of the two evils.

Re: Luxury beliefs are status symbols (2022)

#70

Post by darigo »

Alex Kaschuta discussed this with Rob Henderson on her Subversive podcast: https://www.alexkaschuta.com/p/subversive-podcast-rob-hender...

Her point is that this effect is way bigger in 3rd world countries, where these kinds of beliefs signal alignment with "The West" and the status that comes with that.

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