how does Israel give evacuation warnings if Palestinian telcos are offline?
The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete
61–70 of 610 posts
Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete
#62At this point, I think Gaza is pretty much doomed. There won’t be much left at the end of this special military operation.
There will be 25 miles of beautiful Mediterranean coastline for Israeli settlers. At least, that certainly has to have crossed the mind of someone in power.
> At least, that certainly has to have crossed the mind of someone in power.
100%: https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20231009-israel-mk-calls-f...
Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete
#63Nearly all of the over 7k people killed in Gaza in the past few days are civilians. Sure Hamas, with the help of the media framing of this as a 9/11, gave them a good Casus belli, but Israel has always been good at finding Casus bellis. When Israel again invaded Gaza in 2014, they killed 2,310 people, 70% civilians and lost 67 soldiers in return. Even more destructive was the 7-10k homes completely demolished and 87k…
If you think any other country with a massively more powerful army would put up with a neighbor intermittently terrorizing them and then hide behind civilians and not respond similarly, I'm not sure what to tell you.
Doesn't make it right. But there's no easy way out of this.
Look at the US response to 9-11 to see what other countries would do...
Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete
#64Starlink still working?
Starlink isn't available in that region. If it was, it would of course depend on Elon Musk's mood at any given moment.
Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete
#65Hopefully news crews brought their satellite broadcasting equipment. It's important for the world not be blocked off from seeing what's going on regardless of which side you support.
After the horrendous Hamas attacks of October 7 a portion of the Israeli public sort of lost it and have outright called for retribution. I worry that this indiscriminate bombing campaign combined with a near complete blockade of food, electricity, water of the last two weeks is reflective of that. Now with a lack of communication, I worry about Palestinians. You can never be sure what will happen, but the ingredient…
> have outright called for retribution
When Israel invaded Gaza in 2014 they killed 2,310 people. 70% were civilians. In return they lost only 67 soldiers. They also destroyed 7-10k homes and damaged 87k other homes.
Between 2005-2008, 1,754 Palestinians and 117 Israelis have lost their lives due to the ongoing occupation. Between 2008-2023 2,329 more Palestinians and 308 more Israeli people lost their lives.
The vast majority of Israeli casualties are soldiers and the vast majority of Palestinian casualties are civilian.
Now in the span of just a few days Israel has killed over 7k more Palestinians. This isn't "retribution". This is an ongoing genocide. One which the UN has tried to intercede OVER and OVER and OVER again but always fails. Despite almost every single country in the UN voting on the side of Palestine there is one country that ensures Israel is never held accountable for its war crimes: the United States.
Between 1954 and 2023 the US has used its Veto power to strike down 34 resolutions relating to Palestine and Israel. Resolutions that the entire rest of the world's countries supports. Resolutions that could've stopped or significantly reduced this ongoing bloodshed
Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's estimated that Hamas has between 30,000 and 40,000 soldiers(1), which is about 6% to 8% of Gaza's entire adult male population. There's no way of getting around it: if Israel finishes the job of eradicating Hamas, a large percentage of the Gazan population will be killed or captured, purely because so many of them are actively involved in Hamas. Anyway, if Gazan citizens learn the lessons of their mistakes, they…
petertodd wrote: > Anyway, if Gazan citizens learn the lessons of their mistakes, they still have a future. That is genocidal language where you are holding civilians accountable. The Gazan population does not favor Hamas according to polling prior to October 7th: https://twitter.com/ForeignAffairs/status/171800792755696451... Hamas was also boosted by Netanyahu in part to prevent a two-state solution and diminish mo…
Hamas has an estimated 30,000 to 40,000 soldiers(1). That's about 6% to 8% of the entire adult Gazan male population. It's impossible to have that many soldiers without widespread support. Maybe not a majority. But certainly a significant minority.
Like it or not, a significant percentage of the adult Gazan population are responsible for Hamas because they're actively fighting for Hamas or directly supporting them. Pointing out that those people are accountable, and can choose a different future, is not genocidal language. It's stating the facts of the situation.
Germany also faced the same choice after WW2. They chose to eradicate Nazism, which is a big part of why Germany is the successful country it is today.
1) https://www.axios.com/2023/10/21/palestine-hamas-military-po...
Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete
#67Nearly all of the over 7k people killed in Gaza in the past few days are civilians. Sure Hamas, with the help of the media framing of this as a 9/11, gave them a good Casus belli, but Israel has always been good at finding Casus bellis. When Israel again invaded Gaza in 2014, they killed 2,310 people, 70% civilians and lost 67 soldiers in return. Even more destructive was the 7-10k homes completely demolished and 87k…
[flagged]
In several of your comments in this discussion you seem to be suggesting that all Palestinian civilians are guilty and fair game for retribution.
Reminder that the large majority of Palestinians never voted for Hamas. Even in the last election, which was now 17 years ago, most Palestinians didn't vote for them. Any Palestinian adult who came of age after 2006 didn't vote for them. And not a single Palestinian child has ever voted for Hamas.
Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete
#68Earlier quoted context omitted.
the west had a different opinion on russia doing the same in ukraine
Because Russia's invasion is clearly illegal and immoral. Every act they do in furtherance of that goal is a crime. Every bullet fired, every cell phone tower and every power transformer destroyed. Israel is clearly defending themselves against a genocidal adversary who just killed more Jews in one day than any day since the Holocaust. They have every right to invade Gaza to eliminate that threat.
So the thousands of children killed in Gaza are guilty?
Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete
#69> Taking Gaza completely off the grid while launching an unprecedented bombardment campaign only means something atrocious is about to happen. A war is happening of course. Communications are critical to military operations, and Hamas has been happy to use civilian infrastructure for military purposes. Of course Israel is going to destroy it all. Sure, Hamas can still use older tech like radios. But that's a huge win…
There is no war going on. Wars happen between nations and between armies. Whatever this is it is not a war.
Here’s an historical corollary:
“ The ethnic cleansing of Zamojszczyzna by Nazi Germany (German: Aktion Zamosc,[4] also: Operation Himmlerstadt)[5] during World War II was carried out as part of a greater plan of forcible removal of the entire Polish populations from targeted regions of occupied Poland in preparation for the state-sponsored settlement of the ethnic German Volksdeutsche.”
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_cleansing_of_Zamojszc...
Re: The destruction of Gaza's internet is complete
#70At this point, I think Gaza is pretty much doomed. There won’t be much left at the end of this special military operation.
It's estimated that Hamas has between 30,000 and 40,000 soldiers(1), which is about 6% to 8% of Gaza's entire adult male population. There's no way of getting around it: if Israel finishes the job of eradicating Hamas, a large percentage of the Gazan population will be killed or captured, purely because so many of them are actively involved in Hamas. Anyway, if Gazan citizens learn the lessons of their mistakes, they…
> if Gazan citizens learn the lessons of their mistakes, they still have a future.
What future would that be?
The whole reason this conflict keeps going is because of faulty reasoning like this.
Gazan citizens do not have a say in much of anything, they're either combatants, captives or hostages depending on what your perspective from outside Gaza is.