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Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

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Re: Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

#171

Post by floydian10 »

ReDeiPirati wrote: post #95

I finished my job search after 5 months and 1 week. After 179 applications, 22 interviews, 2 offers later, I'd say that it's one of the toughest and miserable job market someone can find into. I job search-ed even during the pandemic, and although it was very difficult, imho this one is order of magnitude worse... The Senior you are the better chance you'll have, but there is no market for JR, and I feel so bad for t…

> Unfortunately even if you feel like your resume is super strong, getting a job now requires to literally excel in every single step of the interview and having the luck of having the team feeling you as a perfect fit for the team. Even a single meh would mean instant rejection

I'm part of the interview process for a role we're trying to fill, and it's 100% like you describe it. I lost count of how many people we interviewed already (and mind you, we're not looking for anything out of the ordinary).

Re: Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

#172

Post by noveltyaccount »

anthonypasq wrote: post #145
noveltyaccount wrote: post #30

Pretty rough. I'm a senior manager/director (manage software dev managers), 20 years industry, the last 8 in big tech. I've been searching for 2 months, applied to 80 roles at 50 companies...only had three recruiter calls and trying to schedule my first phone screen. Surprised at how slow going it is. Feels like companies are being very selective about who they hire and or which roles they want to fill. I think I hav…

do people at this level actually get jobs that arent through their existing network? Who hires externally at the director level, its it assumed they would require lots of domain knowledge?

A lot of the domain knowledge is about running software organizations, shipping high quality software on time, people management; which is transferrable to many business domains. Look at the LinkedIn jobs search filters - there is a specific filter for experience level that include "director" and "executive." Plenty of external job openings.

I'm using my network too, but most of them are at the Big Tech employer which isn't super useful since I want to branch out!

Re: Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

#173

Post by noveltyaccount »

CableNinja wrote: post #162
irvingprime wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes to not answering stupid questions. One of my pet peeves about job applications is the "Voluntary self-identification" form that has all required answers. So I select "I do not want to answer" and assume they're too stupid to hire me.

Honestly, i think those 3 questions are hot garbage. They shouldnt be asked until an offer is made. Theres no reason to ask them in advance other than to allow for discriminatory decisions, but that decision is easily masked by "we found stronger candidates" auto rejections. Really truly tired of the state of hiring

I'm pretty sure this is a US law to see if protected categories are even applying, and then if they're getting their fair share of offers.

Re: Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

#174

Post by noveltyaccount »

CableNinja wrote: post #122

On the topic of getting hired, id like to take a moment to rant at the employers, and ask you HN folk to do something. PLEASE stop applying to jobs that make you jump through stupid hoops or answer stupid questions that dont need to be asked on applications. Every person that applies and answers these questions are just helping to standardize their use on applications, and it needs to stop. Theres so many that i cant…

Canonical, for a Director job, asked for my high school math & language aptitude (e.g. top x% in school), plus "proof" like SAT/ACT score, and my college GPA. For someone with 20 years' experience it felt offensive.

Re: Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

#175

Post by CableNinja »

noveltyaccount wrote: post #173
CableNinja wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, i think those 3 questions are hot garbage. They shouldnt be asked until an offer is made. Theres no reason to ask them in advance other than to allow for discriminatory decisions, but that decision is easily masked by "we found stronger candidates" auto rejections. Really truly tired of the state of hiring

I'm pretty sure this is a US law to see if protected categories are even applying, and then if they're getting their fair share of offers.

Sure, but that doesnt change that the employer also sees that info, and can reject still, while using some unknown excuse (like a stronger candidate being found, even if thats nit the case). It should not be information visible to the employer at all. The government should be mandating anonymous data, by removing collection from the employer level, and move it to the job site level. Ive yet to see anyone with a homerolled job application site/process, and so it should be easy to get these apps doing it as well. These apps and sites can then send it straight to the government, rather than the employer storing it, or ever having access to it. Alternatively, the data should be required to be encrypted with a pub/priv pair that the government only has access to the private key before sending to employer servers. Ill take almost anything over the employer having access to this info.

As much as i understand why these questions have been mandated, i feel they've become silently weaponized, due to their visibility.

Re: Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

#176

Post by CableNinja »

noveltyaccount wrote: post #174
CableNinja wrote: post #122

On the topic of getting hired, id like to take a moment to rant at the employers, and ask you HN folk to do something. PLEASE stop applying to jobs that make you jump through stupid hoops or answer stupid questions that dont need to be asked on applications. Every person that applies and answers these questions are just helping to standardize their use on applications, and it needs to stop. Theres so many that i cant…

Canonical, for a Director job, asked for my high school math & language aptitude (e.g. top x% in school), plus "proof" like SAT/ACT score, and my college GPA. For someone with 20 years' experience it felt offensive.

Thats just the tip of the iceberg.

Ive seen all kinds of crazy questions. The big offenders though are ones wanting to see your social media and crap. I even had one that wouldnt even let you finish the application without providing them your facebook page, which i dont even have. Or asking your salary range at application, like wtf.

Its a goddamn mess, i dont even know what to do about it

Re: Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

#177

Post by ironmagma »

VirusNewbie wrote: post #150
jcalvinowens wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was an absurd catch-22. I was told, more or less: "We don't think you're qualified for level X, but we still want to hire you into this specific specialized role we advertised as level X, doing all the same specialized work, with all the same expectations and requirements, at level X-1. We pinky promise you we'll promote you quickly because we are confident you are already qualified to handle these level X respons…

Right but was it still going to be a big raise? I guess that's what I'm trying to figure out? Did you reject the job because it was a step down in pay, or simply because of the tile? Usually reqs at Google are for two levels. So a manager can hire a lead, and it can either be senior or staff. G has strict perf requirements so people are much quicker to downlevel and then promote vs. hire at L6 and then fire.

Either way, it's a bait and switch. I wouldn't be interested at all because the company is apparently not to be trusted for their word.

Re: Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

#178

Post by Havoc »

skyyler wrote: post #146
Havoc wrote: post #144

Noticably bleaker responses than the last time this was asked (maybe a month back?). Can't help but feel this isn't just SWE. Feels like the world is wobbling for some reason I can't quite place

Something happened on 7 Oct and things haven't really been the same since.

7 Oct while certainly historically significant & likely significant going forward didn't fuck up the US job market and isn't responsible for the effect I'm trying (badly) to describe. Something in the last ~6 months is just severely off

Re: Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

#179

Post by VirusNewbie »

ironmagma wrote: post #177
VirusNewbie wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right but was it still going to be a big raise? I guess that's what I'm trying to figure out? Did you reject the job because it was a step down in pay, or simply because of the tile? Usually reqs at Google are for two levels. So a manager can hire a lead, and it can either be senior or staff. G has strict perf requirements so people are much quicker to downlevel and then promote vs. hire at L6 and then fire.

Either way, it's a bait and switch. I wouldn't be interested at all because the company is apparently not to be trusted for their word.

It's not a bait and switch, it's called leveling. People can come with 20 YOE and get an L4 offer at google (mid level). and some people take it, because it's still a compensation increase.

Others try for staff and they get senior, which has a wide pay band and can sometimes pay as much as lower staff offers. So calling it a "bait and switch" isn't really accurate at all.

The people who decide your level are not the hiring manager or the interviewers too.

Re: Ask HN: How's your job search going in this current economy?

#180

Post by dansult »

octotoad wrote: post #62
000ooo000 wrote: post #58

(Aus) Going poorly for me. Started my current job a year or so ago, been looking to leave since. Probably into the 100s of applications in the last 12 months now; I will apply for most anything with a tech fit even if (for e.g.) a role requires on-site that I'm not interested in, just to try and get a feel for the market by whether or not I get at least a screening call. I've had 2 final stage interviews: knocked bac…

Same location, similar situation. I thought it was just me. At least twenty recruiters on my LinkedIn list, and not a peep since I toggled my 'Open to work' status weeks ago. Used to receive a fairly consistent stream of messages when I wasn't ready.

Applied for a few positions so far just to see whats up. Only one gave me a rejection. The rest ghosted. Moving state next year and need to find a new gig before then. Sounds like I'll need to start applying a lot more
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