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Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

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Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#411

Post by gemstones »

konschubert wrote: post #312
gemstones wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it’s on you to show what about the correlation makes causation unlikely, and most people don’t take that step. We all know correlation isn’t causation, that’s trite and obvious. Why wouldn’t the correlation between married parents and better child outcomes be causative?

"what can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence" It's on the person who is implying a causation to state why they think that there is such a causal relationship. Marriage success and child success have so many other things that they are correlated to: Home ownership, IQ, wealth, zip code, parental educational background, ability to talk about feelings, empath, conflict skill, ..., So som…

Maybe in high school debate class, it is. But for established societal norms that most people can see the benefits of, someone who comes in with a fringe belief is expected to provide a more interesting answer. If someone said “correlation is not causation” to the assertion that people who go to the gym regularly are more fit, people would dismiss them out of hand and treat them like an annoyance too.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#412

Post by defrost »

gemstones wrote: post #411
konschubert wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"what can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence" It's on the person who is implying a causation to state why they think that there is such a causal relationship. Marriage success and child success have so many other things that they are correlated to: Home ownership, IQ, wealth, zip code, parental educational background, ability to talk about feelings, empath, conflict skill, ..., So som…

Maybe in high school debate class, it is. But for established societal norms that most people can see the benefits of, someone who comes in with a fringe belief is expected to provide a more interesting answer. If someone said “correlation is not causation” to the assertion that people who go to the gym regularly are more fit, people would dismiss them out of hand and treat them like an annoyance too.

That's an incredibly weak and overly dismissive counter to genuine examples of covariant potential causes.

It's seems clear that socio economic status has an enormous influence on child outcomes and is clearly intertwined with other factors.

Do better.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#413

Post by xctr94 »

pb7 wrote: post #335
xctr94 wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re comparing against some of the highest rates in Europe; possibly because the Nordic countries value that same individuality that GP mentioned?

This comment is interesting because these are the same countries that are often used to show how “backwards” the US is due to their comparatively strong safety nets, etc. I guess when it comes to Europe, people can only pick and choose the best example for each discussion despite it varying wildly just like the US, is that right?

No, you’re right; but these 4 countries aren’t even close to the European average on many aspects. Some of them aren’t even part of the EU, which is normally what gets compared against US markers.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#414

Post by bitsage »

jqpabc123 wrote: post #53

Proof that we need more "family values"; more religious conservatism? This is what a lot of people seem to believe --- people who've never bothered to look at the actual evidence --- or who refuse to accept it once they see. A detailed county by county survey of the entire country shows that the most religious and conservative parts of the country have higher divorces rates by far. Getting married in the Bible Belt a…

The study shows even non-religious people in those same counties have high rates of divorce, so it’s clearly an issue affecting everyone.

This is also pointless if they didn’t control for ethnicity. The South has a greater percentage of African-Americans who have higher rates of divorce. The problems beleaguering black communities has more to do with just living in religious or conservative counties

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#415

Post by thoughtpalette »

RecycledEle wrote: post #232
thoughtpalette wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What an archaic way of thought. I can only hope you're not being serious.

Helping our children grow up to be successful adults is not archaic.

Plenty of children raised by a single parent are successful.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#416

Post by snapcaster »

ghusto wrote: post #112
denton-scratch wrote: post #107

Marriage is a legal construct; it can provide a level of security (and fairness) that isn't otherwise accessible. But as the laws change, the benefits change too. I think men marry in the hope of binding their partner; fat chance. Marriage gives the partner a claim on a big chunk of the man's assets, so it incentivizes women to divorce their husbands. The great majority of divorces are initiated by the wife. I'm not…

It's mad, no? When I ask people point blank why they're getting married, they just stare at me. Obviously part of that is because I'm being autistically rude in asking such a questions, but I haven't heard any compelling answers either.

This is really cringe and you're probably not being perceived by others the way you think. I would suggest avoiding asking leading questions like this, it makes you sound like a child or at the very least an incredibly sheltered adult

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#417

Post by danielmarkbruce »

ghusto wrote: post #409
danielmarkbruce wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious. >> Literally everything is not unique to marriage, or made _worse_ by marriage. The words "literally" and"everything" have real meanings. Maybe go through "literally everything". The first two on the list, for example, and consider many different jurisdictions. The cherry picked example is even wrong. In many jurisdictions couples are legally compelled to go to marriage counseling or similar. Australia has i…

> The words "literally" and"everything" have real meanings They do indeed, and I used them correctly :) > In many jurisdictions couples are legally compelled to go to marriage counseling or similar. Australia has it for couples with kids That's pretty messed up. Really? If you have kids, you are legally required to get married in Australia? I couldn't find anything about that, and I find it difficult to believe. > Th…

No no, you are legally required to go to counseling before a divorce. You aren't legally required to get married.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#418

Post by laurencerowe »

Racing0461 wrote: post #382
laurencerowe wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The gain is from married filing jointly while one partner is not working. At $100k it roughly halves the income tax you pay.

If im taking care of a partner, i should be able to deduct expenses up to my total income like corporations can. halving the tax is still not enough to move the needle for people to get married due to better taxes.

This results in those in higher income tax brackets receiving far more money which is deeply inequitable.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#419

Post by Racing0461 »

laurencerowe wrote: post #418
Racing0461 wrote: post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If im taking care of a partner, i should be able to deduct expenses up to my total income like corporations can. halving the tax is still not enough to move the needle for people to get married due to better taxes.

This results in those in higher income tax brackets receiving far more money which is deeply inequitable.

Having single men pay for other men's children, incentivising single motherhood seems inequitable, no?

Lions are smarter than us.

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