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Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

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Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#401

Post by em-bee »

em-bee wrote: post #185
em-bee wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

we do need more family values, but religious conservatism is not that. we also need equality between women and men, and that is where conservatism gets in the way. i suspect that lack of equality is what's driving most divorces in those conservative areas because women no longer allow themselves to be treated as being lesser than men, so they stand up for themselves and the conservative men can't handle that.

it appears that some people disagree with my comment. but i do not understand why. am i misunderstanding what conservatism is? or do people disagree with the idea of equality between men and women? or with the idea that valuing family more would be better?

a response to this comment has been flagged, which hides further responses to that comment that you may want to read: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37980225

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#402

Post by fisttrain »

em-bee wrote: post #400
fisttrain wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i hate to be that guy but... source?

source for what specifically? more family support? compare the support for parents available in the US vs most other countries in the world, in particular the EU and read the comments here. equality between men and women? again, there is plenty of evidence worldwide that we have not achieved that. not by a long shot. the only thing that is not self-evident is the relationship between religious conservatism and divorc…

I am not arguing with you; I am simply pointing out the flaws in your previous argument.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#403

Post by userinanother »

SirMaster wrote: post #361
userinanother wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which might be fine if after that men went home and took over traditional female tasks like cooking, cleaning and childcare. But they didn’t, and instead women ended up bringing in the money and having to do everything else while the husbands played video games and didn’t contribute. This resulted in women getting rid of the husband so they didn’t have an extra kid to take care of.

So then this creates a viscous cycle where the single woman will raise boys without a father role model, and those boys will go onto become poor husbands etc? This kind of feels like part of the problem here.

But if the father is terrible and just another mouth to feed idk if any better

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#404

Post by skissane »

skissane wrote: post #383
mvncleaninst wrote: post #372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh wow, Aquinas opining about something he himself had never experienced. I'm sure this has some merit. Let's spend a couple hundred years trying to figure out what he meant, I'm sure we'll get somewhere

I used to think marriage was pointless. Aquinas helped me change my mind about that. And now I am married with two children. But one of those children is older than the marriage is. (Actually both if we count from conception as opposed to from marriage.)

> Actually both if we count from conception as opposed to from marriage.)

I meant to say “from birth” (think one word type another; a “thinko”?)

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#405

Post by em-bee »

fisttrain wrote: post #402
em-bee wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

source for what specifically? more family support? compare the support for parents available in the US vs most other countries in the world, in particular the EU and read the comments here. equality between men and women? again, there is plenty of evidence worldwide that we have not achieved that. not by a long shot. the only thing that is not self-evident is the relationship between religious conservatism and divorc…

I am not arguing with you; I am simply pointing out the flaws in your previous argument.

I am not arguing with you

reading emotions in text messages being difficult as it is, it would be helpful to point that out up front. it helps avoid a wrong reading.

to me these points are more or less self evident, but it is fair to point out that not everyone may see it that way, so thanks for prompting me to elaborate.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#406

Post by fisttrain »

em-bee wrote: post #405
fisttrain wrote: post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not arguing with you; I am simply pointing out the flaws in your previous argument.

I am not arguing with you reading emotions in text messages being difficult as it is, it would be helpful to point that out up front. it helps avoid a wrong reading. to me these points are more or less self evident, but it is fair to point out that not everyone may see it that way, so thanks for prompting me to elaborate.

I appreciate your perspective, although I must express my continued disagreement. It is evident that I perceive a bias in the source material. (i love arguing)

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#407

Post by em-bee »

fisttrain wrote: post #406
em-bee wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not arguing with you reading emotions in text messages being difficult as it is, it would be helpful to point that out up front. it helps avoid a wrong reading. to me these points are more or less self evident, but it is fair to point out that not everyone may see it that way, so thanks for prompting me to elaborate.

I appreciate your perspective, although I must express my continued disagreement. It is evident that I perceive a bias in the source material. (i love arguing)

with which point though?

i admit that the for last one about divorces caused by lack of equality more evidence would be good. but the other two are solid. if you have a different opinion on those, i'd love to hear it.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#408

Post by fisttrain »

em-bee wrote: post #407
fisttrain wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate your perspective, although I must express my continued disagreement. It is evident that I perceive a bias in the source material. (i love arguing)

with which point though? i admit that the for last one about divorces caused by lack of equality more evidence would be good. but the other two are solid. if you have a different opinion on those, i'd love to hear it.

you said it yourself; The statement about divorces caused by a lack of equality lacks evidence.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#409

Post by ghusto »

danielmarkbruce wrote: post #371
ghusto wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't tell if you're serious. Literally everything on their is either not unique to marriage, or made _worse_ by marriage. I won't go through each nonsense reason in turn, but this one is pertinent: > Accountability and Conflict Resolution > > Resolution Mechanisms: Marriage often compels couples to work out their differences and disputes in a more committed manner, as there is more at stake. The opposite is true. Pe…

Serious. >> Literally everything is not unique to marriage, or made _worse_ by marriage. The words "literally" and"everything" have real meanings. Maybe go through "literally everything". The first two on the list, for example, and consider many different jurisdictions. The cherry picked example is even wrong. In many jurisdictions couples are legally compelled to go to marriage counseling or similar. Australia has i…

> The words "literally" and"everything" have real meanings

They do indeed, and I used them correctly :)

> In many jurisdictions couples are legally compelled to go to marriage counseling or similar. Australia has it for couples with kids

That's pretty messed up. Really? If you have kids, you are legally required to get married in Australia? I couldn't find anything about that, and I find it difficult to believe.

> The anecdote is nothing more than that

K, but I still don't see marriage working in my immediate circle, nor wider society. I don't need a scientific study to draw conclusions from that.

Re: Children of married parents do better, but America is moving the other way

#410

Post by andyjohnson0 »

laurencerowe wrote: post #376
andyjohnson0 wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So in your view they're going from cohabiting to marriage to separated/divorced, rather than cohabiting to separated? In that case it seems more likely to me (non-US person) that cultural factors are pushing people towards marriage, rather than purely financial considerations.

Specifically on the "unmarried adults who decide to live together do it for a much shorter duration than in Europe." quoted in the parent comment. I think there are cultural reasons why Americans are more likely to get married too, but don't discount the financial incentives since they are pretty substantial for new parents. Remember this is a country with no right to paid maternity leave! Take an example of an unmar…

Thanks. Those numbers are quite pursuasive.
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