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George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

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Re: George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

#361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which term would you use to distinguish between deliberate and accidental civilian casualties?

The difference between deliberate and accidental civilian casualties is not clear cut. For instance, what do you call it when you intend to attack the enemies soldiers with a bunch of bombs but you know a certain percentage will fall on civilians and you accept that inevitability and proceed anyway? Is that deliberate? Not quite, because it wasn't your intention. Was it an accident? Not really, because you knew it wa…

Response to memefrog's [dead] comment:

> It's not deliberate, which is the question that matters.

I don't agree that deliberate or not deliberate is all that matters or the end of the discussion. In criminal law if you do something that could reasonably be expected to kill somebody without really desiring that outcome, you might still be guilty or murder or at least manslaughter. For instance if you drive your motorcycle at 200 MPH and crash into a family killing them, the fact that you lacked a specific desire to kill those people counts for something but it's not the end of the discussion.

> "[targeting the civilian workforce] isn't a thing."

You've obviously read my comment as commentary on the Israel/Palestine situation. Actually the incident I had in mind when I was writing that comment was the firebombing of Tokyo. If you go through official US documents about that, you'll find the justification that Tokyo had extensive cottage/light industry mixed in with their residential neighborhoods. Destroying that industry and workforce was in fact one of the official intents for firebombing Tokyo. However many of the bomber crews (who were all men, but I'm generally not one for gender-inclusive terminology anyway so you're not catching me in some hypocrisy here, lmao) were likely motivated by revenge for Pearl Harbor / etc and celebrated the civilian death toll. Not all of them I'm sure, but certainly some of them.

Anyway, I'm not here to pass judgement on whether the firebombing of Tokyo was or wasn't a war-crime, or whether or not the US was deliberately trying to kill Japanese kids. It has been debated for decades and that's precisely my point. It's not cut and dry, it's a matter that looks differently to different people who are looking back at it from different perspectives. It defies neat objective categorization, which is why counting 'civilian casualties' in one big lump, not differentiating by intent, is a useful thing to do.

Re: George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

#362
post #329

> Partly cloudy became partly sunny. Here it Texas, it's still Partly Cloudy, probably because we get more than enough sun.

I used to wonder about this too but there is a semi-scientific difference between the two. There are more clouds with partly cloudy than with partly sunny.

Re: George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

#363
post #24

One I recently heard was "conducting a rif" == "conducting a reduction in force" == "firing people". Soft language is alway to the benefit of the speaker, to assuage guilt or obfuscate intent. It's always to the detriment of the listener.

A hiring platform where you would apply for jobs changed the applicatin status from Rejected to Denied to Disqualified. Doesn’t matter that you didn’t get the job at least you weren’t rejected!

Re: George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

#364

Wasn't a lot of this "soft language" the result of active and conscious work by people like Frank Luntz [0] e.g. - "energy exploration" to refer to oil drilling - "climate change" instead of global warming My understanding is that he used focus groups watching video of politicians. As the politician would speak, the watchers would use dials to live rate how they felt about the words being used. In essence, he would A…

The wiki page on climate change [1] explains that climate change was already a growing to be preferred term earlier than Frank Luntz memo. Which I think is correct because it is much more accurate. There is a lot more to climate change than global warming. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change#Terminology

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Re: George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

#365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Rapid climate change" is what I would say is the most specific term, because climates change naturally over time, but usually do so slowly enough that there is no risk to individuals. The kind of climate change due to human interactions is so rapid that individuals are at risk, for instance those who live in low-lying coastal areas. Species evolve when there is slow climate change, but rapid changes make whole clade…

Well, the term used for 'climate change due to human interactions' is anthropogenic climate change. Which plays exactly into George Carlin said. Why use 'anthropogenic climate change' which a regular person won't know the meaning of instead of 'human-caused climate change' or something.

The only change that's of global concern is the spiking energy accumulation. It's global warming, as most people would understand it from reading the link. Climate change is soft language to lump in secondary effects, to make it acceptable for deniers and special interests.

Re: George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

#366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Today, one often hears "He is special needs" said by people who think they are being politically correct. But that's awfully wrong. He might have special needs, but he is not needs. He is a person. To me, that's a lot more dehumanizing than saying "retarded". Then they'll say "but you know what I mean". That's the point, exactly.

The ultimate culmination being certain subreddits where the banned "retarded" has been replaced by the homonym "regarded", such that referring to someone as "highly regarded" is understood to mean the former, not the latter.

That's pretty ducking clever

Re: George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

#367

Wasn't a lot of this "soft language" the result of active and conscious work by people like Frank Luntz [0] e.g. - "energy exploration" to refer to oil drilling - "climate change" instead of global warming My understanding is that he used focus groups watching video of politicians. As the politician would speak, the watchers would use dials to live rate how they felt about the words being used. In essence, he would A…

[deleted]

Re: George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

#368

Control the language and you control everything made from it. I can be civil and choose words, but it's why I won't have my language policed either. A lot of euphemisms aren't meaningful about the subject, but more about demonstrating alignment to others who are operating on the subject. It's the banality of people who think in clichés.

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Re: George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

#369
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nihilism and misanthropy are valid philosophical positions though.

No doubt but he's a comedian, not a philosopher. Carlin's crusty curmudgeon personality never did much for me. I'm an atheist but his whole anti religion shtick really turned me off.

I recommend consulting his early/middle material... 1967–1990 maybe. You're only really referring to his last 10–15 years or so.

Re: George Carlin's "Soft Language" (2019)

#370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unpopular opinion: much of what he said was just total bs. Even in an example from this article, he goes on a tangent about phrases that were not used then and still are not used. "They're not used cars, they're 'previously owned automobiles.'" What? Nobody calls them that, even today, 30 some odd years later. In my opinion, George Carlin sometimes had some kernel of good observation at the heart of his bits, that he…

he gave simple-minded people comfort for an increasingly complicated world. But notably absent from his calculated monlogue was "grandma went to heaven / (in a better place)", vs "she DIED". even crusty old George knew how far he could push it.

He did say he would never die, just "pass away."
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