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The Darién Gap

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Re: The Darién Gap

#31

Post by DonaldFisk »

f5ve wrote: post #5

In the 1690's the Scottish invested an enormous sum of money and human capital to settle this region. The goal was to build and profit from an overland route to ferry cargo from the Pacific to the Atlantic, similar to the Panama Canal today. Due to disease, less-than-accommodating natives, and geopolitical climate, the scheme failed miserably. Many argue the crippling financial effect on Scotland was a key factor in…

> less-than-accommodating natives,

The Guna (a.k.a. Kuna) natives were actually helpful, providing food to the colonists, who formed an alliance with them against the Spanish, who were hostile to both Kuna and Scots.

Re: The Darién Gap

#32

Post by PanamaNewb »

Hey there. I'm from Panama.

The Darien Gap still has foreigners (including wealthy tourists) going there with the crazy idea they can hike through it. The trash being left behind in just the past couple years is just heartbreaking.

Mountainous jungles in Panama are extremely easy to get lost in the overgrown vegetation. Tourists have died in hiking trails in Boquete, Veraguas or Cerro Azul by only going a few hundred meters off path.

Also, most Panamanians are against the idea of building a road between Darien and Colombia since most of us want to preserve as much jungle as we still can.

There is currently massive protests against the mining operation in Donoso by the Canadian company First Quantum Minerals (FQM). I imagine there would be similar blockades against foreign companies trying to build a road in the darien gap.

Re: The Darién Gap

#33

Post by [deleted] »

grecy wrote: post #9
urbandw311er wrote: post #3

I’ve always been fascinated by the Darien gap. There’s a TV show here in the Uk called “race across the world” and in last season they had to cross the gap. Was really hoping for racing jeeps and armed militia but sadly (and sensibly) they took a boat.

I drove the entire Pan-American Highway (shipped around the Darien). Getting to see the Panama Canal and the whole region was just one of hundreds of highlights. It's commonly done now, and you can totally do it yourself in any vehicle.

[deleted]

Re: The Darién Gap

#34

Post by sungam »

PanamaNewb wrote: post #32

Hey there. I'm from Panama. The Darien Gap still has foreigners (including wealthy tourists) going there with the crazy idea they can hike through it. The trash being left behind in just the past couple years is just heartbreaking. Mountainous jungles in Panama are extremely easy to get lost in the overgrown vegetation. Tourists have died in hiking trails in Boquete, Veraguas or Cerro Azul by only going a few hundred…

Sounds like an incredibly risky area but in terms of navigation can they not use gps?

Re: The Darién Gap

#36

Post by hermitcrab »

dfawcus wrote: post #7
f5ve wrote: post #5

In the 1690's the Scottish invested an enormous sum of money and human capital to settle this region. The goal was to build and profit from an overland route to ferry cargo from the Pacific to the Atlantic, similar to the Panama Canal today. Due to disease, less-than-accommodating natives, and geopolitical climate, the scheme failed miserably. Many argue the crippling financial effect on Scotland was a key factor in…

There was more to the Scottish colony in Darien failing than just that, the English state had a hand in it, and an incentive to ensure it failed. As to the post failure financial effect, that was mainly on a bunch of rich folks. Scotland per-se was not in any financial distress after the failure of the scheme, as it was private individuals, not the state which had invested. Have a read of this piece, which covers a l…

There is a useful overview at: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darien_scheme

Re: The Darién Gap

#37

Post by WarOnPrivacy »

jpcfl wrote: post #28

I know several people who have made the foot journey across the Darién, and have heard many horror stories about it. When I was in Bogotá last year, I met a Venezuelan man selling art painted on Bolivares. Inflation is so bad in Venezuela that Bolivares are practically worthless as currency. (There's also a beautiful irony that painting a picture of Che Guevara on a Bolivar makes it more valuable.) Many of his pieces…

> When I was in Bogotá last year, I met a Venezuelan man selling art ... Many of his pieces were portraits of people who crossed the Darién fleeing Venezuela.

Maybe I'm missing something.

Folks are fleeing Venezuela. They pass thru Columbia and crossed the Darién into Panama.

How did the guy in Bogotá meet people who crossed the Darién?

Edit: Never mind. I think you meant: portraits of people who were going to cross the Darién, now having fled Venezuela.

Re: The Darién Gap

#38

Post by kortilla »

PanamaNewb wrote: post #32

Hey there. I'm from Panama. The Darien Gap still has foreigners (including wealthy tourists) going there with the crazy idea they can hike through it. The trash being left behind in just the past couple years is just heartbreaking. Mountainous jungles in Panama are extremely easy to get lost in the overgrown vegetation. Tourists have died in hiking trails in Boquete, Veraguas or Cerro Azul by only going a few hundred…

How much of it is about preserving jungles and how much is about keeping Colombians out?

From the article yesterday about the failed pan American highway due to the Darien gap, it pointed out that Colombia and Panama are the only two neighboring countries in the world without a road between them. It also explicitly stated that many citizens support that to reduce undocumented immigrants from Colombia.

Re: The Darién Gap

#39

Post by m-i-l »

dfawcus wrote: post #7
f5ve wrote: post #5

In the 1690's the Scottish invested an enormous sum of money and human capital to settle this region. The goal was to build and profit from an overland route to ferry cargo from the Pacific to the Atlantic, similar to the Panama Canal today. Due to disease, less-than-accommodating natives, and geopolitical climate, the scheme failed miserably. Many argue the crippling financial effect on Scotland was a key factor in…

There was more to the Scottish colony in Darien failing than just that, the English state had a hand in it, and an incentive to ensure it failed. As to the post failure financial effect, that was mainly on a bunch of rich folks. Scotland per-se was not in any financial distress after the failure of the scheme, as it was private individuals, not the state which had invested. Have a read of this piece, which covers a l…

> "As to the post failure financial effect, that was mainly on a bunch of rich folks."

Although trickle-down economics is largely discredited when it comes to wealth, I suspect the same isn't the case when it comes to debt. For example, one of the causes of the Highland Clearances (which began around a generation after the Darien Scheme) was landlord debt[0].

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highland_Clearances#Landlord_d...

Re: The Darién Gap

#40

Post by kortilla »

hermitcrab wrote: post #17
euroderf wrote: post #6

It feels like an admission of failure on the part of civil engineering culture.

Would it be a triumph of engineering culture to pave over the whole world?

No. There is a clear demand for a route here that has not been met. There is no demand for paving over the world.
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