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Meta is banning people from advertising after running ads for Python and Pandas

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Re: Meta is banning people from advertising after running ads for Python and Pandas

#121

Post by nxobject »

0xpgm wrote: post #95
lbriner wrote: post #47

The whole issue around not telling you what rule you broke "because then you might work around it" is total BS. It's like a company I complained to the other day because they didn't label one of the inputs on their password reset form because "it would help a hacker know what to type in it" (it was the password reset password they expected but you wouldn't know). How much quicker would this be resolved if the first A…

And some of these companies pride themselves as AI technology pioneers. Yet it seems their automated systems in this case are simply doing keyword matching. Mind-boggling!

To be fair, it's also a failure of empathy for a user who might be flagged as a false positive.

Re: Meta is banning people from advertising after running ads for Python and Pandas

#122

Post by petargyurov »

random_coder wrote: post #118
pr337h4m wrote: post #57

>That’s right: I teach courses in Python and Pandas. Never mind that the first is a programming language and the second is a library for data analysis in Python. Meta’s AI system noticed that I was talking about Python and Pandas, assumed that I was talking about the animals (not the technology), and banned me. If this is true, that is insanely embarrassing for a company that purports to be a sophisticated programmat…

What's wrong with talking about animals anyway? Truly bizarre.

I'm assuming something to do with the illegal trading of exotic/endangered species; mentioning pythons and pandas, alongside whatever wording was used to sell the course probably triggered the bot to flag it.

That's the only explanation I have.

Re: Meta is banning people from advertising after running ads for Python and Pandas

#123

Post by Aeolun »

Xixi wrote: post #44

AIs and other opaque processes making decisions are incredibly frustrating. I'm still wondering why my tea-of-the-month business [0] got turned down by Stripe when I incorporated an LLC (technically a Godo Kaisha, as it is incorporated in Japan). It came as a surprise as it was perfectly fine by them for as long as it was a sole proprietorship. Which is why I strongly suspect the rejection came from an AI. At the tim…

You can always contact them? I can’t say my experience with their support has been anything like good, but we did eventually resolve the problem.

Apparently Stripe has great difficulty with non-Japanese people, living in Japan, owning a company overseas.

Re: Meta is banning people from advertising after running ads for Python and Pandas

#124

Post by NullPrefix »

CalRobert wrote: post #89
lbriner wrote: post #47

The whole issue around not telling you what rule you broke "because then you might work around it" is total BS. It's like a company I complained to the other day because they didn't label one of the inputs on their password reset form because "it would help a hacker know what to type in it" (it was the password reset password they expected but you wouldn't know). How much quicker would this be resolved if the first A…

In theory the GDPR means you should be able to request all your data as well as opt out of automated decision making (which would address the "why was I flagged?" and "stop being stupid this is clearly not a snake") side of things. Of course, that's only in Europe and it's not a very easy law to avail of, sadly.

> you should be able ...

And then you get banned for life

Re: Meta is banning people from advertising after running ads for Python and Pandas

#125

Post by HPsquared »

Lio wrote: post #93
m4rtink wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not telling you whats wrong should be highly ilegal, given how important these systems can be for modern society.

I'd prefer it if we legislated that organisations can't exclusively rely on closed systems like Facebook/Meta to run their services. I saw a sign last year for forestry service work happening locally to me. Apparently they're only going to provide safety announcements on Facebook. Shit like that grinds my gears. Meta's users aren't citizens, they're serfs. :(

Serfs were at least tied to the land and somewhat entitled to live there. It's a lower status than serfs.

Re: Meta is banning people from advertising after running ads for Python and Pandas

#126

Post by JacobSeated »

Regardless of the reason, of course not acceptable. We have to insist on complete transparency, and life-time bans should always be liftable through some sort of dialogue. It is impossible to have a productive relationship with someone that abuses AI to conduct reviews that should clearly have been done by a human. Facebook cannot be trusted. Period. Their conduct is extremely abusive.

Same lack of proper review prevents people from restoring hacked accounts, even in cases where it is completely obvious that the accounts were hacked. E.g. The name and/or e-mail was changed by a user in a different country than the account owner.

If Facebook has access to such sophisticated AI, then it is quite amazing that they cannot deduce (even without AI) that an account was hacked. A set of if statements in their code should be enough to check for typical suspicious circumstances. E.g. The user is suddenly in a different country, and happen to change their name (highly unusual and very suspicious circumstances)!!

Re: Meta is banning people from advertising after running ads for Python and Pandas

#127

Post by raincole »

lbriner wrote: post #47

The whole issue around not telling you what rule you broke "because then you might work around it" is total BS. It's like a company I complained to the other day because they didn't label one of the inputs on their password reset form because "it would help a hacker know what to type in it" (it was the password reset password they expected but you wouldn't know). How much quicker would this be resolved if the first A…

When we submitted our game's store page for Steam to review, they told us exactly which rule we broke and how we needed to fix it.

That's how you tell companies who care about their users and those don't.

(Not saying Steam never did shady stuff)

Re: Meta is banning people from advertising after running ads for Python and Pandas

#128

Post by dalbasal »

So... certainly with social media, the rules the rules and only we know the rulebook.

The incentives are just stacked towards not having policies.

First once you have a policy, that policy can be criticised. Nothing withstands criticism these days. Politics also lost its explicit policy statements for the same reason.

If one politician has a policy plan, his opponent's "policy" will be a critique of his plan and that gives the opponent an edge.

Second, once e have a policy, you need to implement it. FB is better resourced than all the others, but none of these "policies" are even designed to be implemented broadly.

Vagueness just serves, and if you aren't vague you will regret it.

If you are clear, there will be a ton of criticism of your clear policy. Then there will be criticism of your imperfect implementation.

If you're vague and concommital, you can half implement a half baked plan plan and change or drop it when you want.

Re: Meta is banning people from advertising after running ads for Python and Pandas

#129

Post by bell-cot »

Lio wrote: post #93
m4rtink wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not telling you whats wrong should be highly ilegal, given how important these systems can be for modern society.

I'd prefer it if we legislated that organisations can't exclusively rely on closed systems like Facebook/Meta to run their services. I saw a sign last year for forestry service work happening locally to me. Apparently they're only going to provide safety announcements on Facebook. Shit like that grinds my gears. Meta's users aren't citizens, they're serfs. :(

> I saw a sign last year for forestry service work happening locally to me. Apparently they're only going to provide safety announcements on Facebook.

There probably are (and should be) laws or regulations forbidding that, especially because "safety".

OTOH, from the PoV of the lower-level Forestry Service people who decided to do that - I'd guess they're stuck in a miserably understaffed and low-budget bit of a pretty dysfunctional government, and doing traditional safety announcements would cost them 100X the time and headaches of "just put it on Facebook".

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