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In California, you can now sell your ADU

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Re: In California, you can now sell your ADU

#61

Post by UncleOxidant »

ryeights wrote: post #49
ryeights wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea is degrading. A generation of people for which the only feasible path to home ownership is living in a mobile/kit home in someone else’s backyard.

To elaborate: this would be a fine policy IFF it were accompanied by other legislation that meaningfully improved the affordability of non-ADU homes as well.

Such as? Isn't the ADU going to be more affordable than the non-ADU home by definition (unless the ADU is actually larger than the house that was there first)?

Re: In California, you can now sell your ADU

#62

Post by Izikiel43 »

The problem with San Francisco, Seattle, and Vancouver (BC), and other cities with housing issues is simple, Americans seem to hate apartments, everyone wants houses, so most of the cities are zoned for SFH (Seattle and Vancouver for sure).

If you built 10 floor buildings everywhere, with 2/3 bedroom apartments, even at 1 apartment per floor, housing stops being an issue in 5 years. However, go to Seattle, San Francisco and Vancouver, out of their downtowns, houses everywhere.

Housing is a solved issue, cities in Asia and Latin America with the same surface area as SF, Seattle and Vancouver fit 3x to 4x more people, but they build up and increase density.

All these housing threads are frustrating because of this, just build buildings.

Re: In California, you can now sell your ADU

#63

Post by Isthatablackgsd »

TheBlight wrote: post #40
bugglebeetle wrote: post #22

I’ve resigned myself to the fact that California has signed a suicide pact with real estate speculators that can’t be revoked because of the political consequences of enacting policies that cause prices to go down or even stabilize. Like with the homeless crisis (which is the direct result of the housing crisis), the state will waste billions doing anything and everything to look like they’re working on the problem,…

>which is the direct result of the housing crisis The homeless crisis is better described as a mental health and substance abuse and addiction crisis.

> The homeless crisis is better described as a mental health and substance abuse and addiction crisis.

It is not always like that. I met people who are homeless and living in the car, they don't have mental health, substance or addiction problem. They are homeless because they couldn't afford the housing cost (including apartments).

The homeless crisis is a direct result of the housing rising costs. Los Angeles and San Diego in Southern California have increasing homeless population due to housing cost. I remember 12 years ago, LA downtown have a smaller homeless popultion and they are usually out of the way. I visited my friend this year who lives in LA and homeless people are in every block of downtown which is barely a thing 12 years ago. This is the result of the housing cost crisis.

You might be wondering why the homeless couldn't move to somewhere else? The thing is they can't because metropolis cities have a better social services they can provide for homeless populations and larger access to facilities within a block than a suburban or rural cities. Majority of them don't have access to transportation that they can afford.

30 years ago, the homeless are a result of mental health, substance abuse and addiction crisis. Now, that changes because of other factors such as rising housing costs which is a bigger factor.

Re: In California, you can now sell your ADU

#64

Post by hnav »

bugglebeetle wrote: post #22

I’ve resigned myself to the fact that California has signed a suicide pact with real estate speculators that can’t be revoked because of the political consequences of enacting policies that cause prices to go down or even stabilize. Like with the homeless crisis (which is the direct result of the housing crisis), the state will waste billions doing anything and everything to look like they’re working on the problem,…

This is why individuals being able to ask "cui bono?" is sorely needed in a democracy, unfortunately the population votes largely based on tribalism and sentiment. Proposition 13 was passed under the guise of not pricing grandma out of the house she grew old in while largely benefiting corporate interests. I'm sure whenever such legislation is introduced there's a massive asymmetry of information since big money that stands to make big money can spend big money on drowning out dissenting opinions.

Re: In California, you can now sell your ADU

#65

Post by sokoloff »

ryeights wrote: post #49
ryeights wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea is degrading. A generation of people for which the only feasible path to home ownership is living in a mobile/kit home in someone else’s backyard.

To elaborate: this would be a fine policy IFF it were accompanied by other legislation that meaningfully improved the affordability of non-ADU homes as well.

Isn't that letting the perfect be the enemy of the good?

Re: In California, you can now sell your ADU

#66

Post by TedDoesntTalk »

bugglebeetle wrote: post #27
username321 wrote: post #5

“While the bar for affordability is low—one 748-square-foot property included in the report sold for $610,000 in 2022—“ Sorry, the bar is LOW?

You mean you don’t want to pay 4K a month to live in a shed in someone’s backyard? Do you hate common sense, market-based solutions or something?

With 20% down ($122k), 7% interest with 30 year fixed rate on $488,000, monthly payments are $3247. Not $4000 but still a lot for a shed.

Re: In California, you can now sell your ADU

#67

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

yonran wrote: post #55
umeshunni wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't afford to move because they have to pay capital gains tax is such a bullshit reason. Pay it from the fucking gains, grandma..

I wish reporters highlighted the stepped up basis tax loophole that causes the bizarre behavior, rather than claiming that grandmothers just can’t “afford” to sell. Many grandmothers would “afford” to sell their house if there were no tax benefit to holding it until death. Same with the “Buy, borrow, die” behavior that ProPublica reported on ( https://www.propublica.org/article/the-secret-irs-files-trov... ). Instead…

What is the tax benefit of stepped-up basis over 1031-ing into RE rental properties and a cheaper primary residence?

In California - obviously prop 13 if someone in the family plans to keep the house.

Re: In California, you can now sell your ADU

#68

Post by epistasis »

Izikiel43 wrote: post #62

The problem with San Francisco, Seattle, and Vancouver (BC), and other cities with housing issues is simple, Americans seem to hate apartments, everyone wants houses, so most of the cities are zoned for SFH (Seattle and Vancouver for sure). If you built 10 floor buildings everywhere, with 2/3 bedroom apartments, even at 1 apartment per floor, housing stops being an issue in 5 years. However, go to Seattle, San Franci…

Polling shows that there's only a slight preference for single family homes. Yet the land usage is absolutely dominated by bans on apartments.

If preferences really were so strong for single family homes, there wouldn't have to be a legal ban on other forms of housing.

This stranglehold on the housing problem, by a few politicians and a small number of homeowners banning others from living their preferred way of life, is the true cause of the shortage.

Re: In California, you can now sell your ADU

#69

Post by brvsft »

unshavedyak wrote: post #20
game_the0ry wrote: post #9

US standard of living is decreasing and will never come back. Many economic anomalies can be observed to prove this: inflation is just one. But I think the most dangerous anomaly has been real estate. In, what is ostensibly the most progressive, most prosperous state in the union, you can build a "mini house" (accessory dwelling unit) on your property and rent it out. The ideal target market would be my generation (m…

Wait, Texas doesn't allow you to sell an ADU? Would have thought anything goes over there since my friends so frequently tout ultimate freedom/etc.

Well, they also support property rights, not just freedom.

"Selling" your ADU would either require dividing up the parcel (which I am guessing is nontrivial in most places) or somehow itemizing improvements on the parcel so that the ADU owner can pay taxes for their unit separately from the main home on the property.

No reason to figure out a solution to any of this when housing isn't much of a problem there.

Re: In California, you can now sell your ADU

#70

Post by TheBlight »

bugglebeetle wrote: post #52
TheBlight wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>which is the direct result of the housing crisis The homeless crisis is better described as a mental health and substance abuse and addiction crisis.

…is what you say if you’re a real estate speculator trying to distract from root causes. Housing affordability and homelessness are directly correlated: > A large body of academic research has consistently found that homelessness in an area is driven by housing costs, whether expressed in terms of rents, rent-to-income ratios, price-to-income ratios, or home prices. Further, changes in rents precipitate changes in ra…

Housing is expensive in desirable places. These areas are also traditionally quite affluent and liberal -- because you need to be relatively rich to live there. As a result, they tend to be much more accommodating to the homeless and addiction. That doesn't mean housing prices in LA/SF/Miami/NYC are the reason homeless people gravitate there but it does explain a correlation.
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