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Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

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Re: Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

#41

Post by sirsinsalot »

ddmf wrote: post #37
kredd wrote: post #8

My friend and I have a theory that a significant chunk of the problems mentioned in the article could be solved if every guy had a genuine platonic friend who is a girl. No data point other than every guy that I know who has close friend girls, never had problems with masculinity or something. And the opposite is true as well. I might be in a very limited bubble as well, as my very close bubble of decade+ friend grou…

I wasn't allowed women pals when I was with my wife, she saw them as competition, and I didn't have many growing up. Since separating - I've met a few wonderful women who I'm still in touch with - one is my "bestie" for sure and we meet up to eat, I'll go round and play with her kids too. My daughter and I are really close too - we go food shopping once a week, have done since lockdown, and it's amazing how much deep…

Wow she sounds really secure in herself. Glad you got out.

Re: Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

#42

Post by kredd »

ddmf wrote: post #37
kredd wrote: post #8

My friend and I have a theory that a significant chunk of the problems mentioned in the article could be solved if every guy had a genuine platonic friend who is a girl. No data point other than every guy that I know who has close friend girls, never had problems with masculinity or something. And the opposite is true as well. I might be in a very limited bubble as well, as my very close bubble of decade+ friend grou…

I wasn't allowed women pals when I was with my wife, she saw them as competition, and I didn't have many growing up. Since separating - I've met a few wonderful women who I'm still in touch with - one is my "bestie" for sure and we meet up to eat, I'll go round and play with her kids too. My daughter and I are really close too - we go food shopping once a week, have done since lockdown, and it's amazing how much deep…

Ha, that’s actually great to hear! I genuinely enjoy hearing stories like that, making our tiny theory a bit more believable.

Regarding the jealousy of others’ partners — it is always a problem! According to my girl friends, we (guys in our group) come up pretty often in talks with their partners or new boyfriends. We try to overcome those problems by either introducing our significant others to the friend group as soon as possible, or exclusively date people who also have platonic friends of opposite sexes.

Obviously sometimes things go wrong, then we have to explain these people in very toddler-esque way (“Do you have any siblings of opposite sex? You wouldn’t consider that relationship romantic, would you? Yeah it’s that between us.”). Some people don’t buy it, but we’re kinda used to it at this point. But oh well, such is life.

Re: Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

#43

Post by kredd »

jgilias wrote: post #40
kredd wrote: post #8

My friend and I have a theory that a significant chunk of the problems mentioned in the article could be solved if every guy had a genuine platonic friend who is a girl. No data point other than every guy that I know who has close friend girls, never had problems with masculinity or something. And the opposite is true as well. I might be in a very limited bubble as well, as my very close bubble of decade+ friend grou…

It’s good to appreciate that people can be really different. For me your suggestion is a catch-22. For me to have a _close_ friendship with someone I need to like them a lot. But knowing myself, if I like someone a lot I _will_ fall in love. As in, this has happened and not once. My wife on the other hand is a direct opposite of that. From having discussed past relationships, I don’t think she even knows what falling…

Totally fair, I guess I should not be making such generalized comments. Probably a lot of self-selection bias happening in my bubble too.

Re: Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

#44

Post by jgilias »

kredd wrote: post #43
jgilias wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s good to appreciate that people can be really different. For me your suggestion is a catch-22. For me to have a _close_ friendship with someone I need to like them a lot. But knowing myself, if I like someone a lot I _will_ fall in love. As in, this has happened and not once. My wife on the other hand is a direct opposite of that. From having discussed past relationships, I don’t think she even knows what falling…

Totally fair, I guess I should not be making such generalized comments. Probably a lot of self-selection bias happening in my bubble too.

I think your comment is totally fine to be honest!

I used to be one of those people who believed that opposite gender close friendships are not possible, but then I came to realize that I’ve just been projecting myself onto other people. I know people who have close, long-term friendships like that, and it’s working out just fine! So, yeah, people are different!

Re: Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

#45

Post by louistsi »

HL33tibCe7 wrote: post #27
taway1237 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that how native speakers understand this proverb? I always assumed "a good man" here is synonymous with "a good human", because that's how if goes in my language, and because it's the only way this makes sense.

I’m a native speaker and interpret “man” in this context as definitely male, and I’d be very surprised if any other native speakers disagreed with that. I think it’s because “a good man” is quantified by the indefinite article “a”. Whereas “man” in a sentence without that qualification, e.g. “one small step for man” I would not interpret the same way. So, “a man” = a male human, “man” = maybe a male human, maybe any…

I definitely disagree given that Marcus Aurelius was writing in an era where "man" in the written word was synonymous with "human", in any context. If you or I said "man" in this time period, certainly we would attribute it as you say.

Re: Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

#46

Post by yetihehe »

codeulike wrote: post #35
mnky9800n wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

then why pay someone to talk as opposed to going to the pub with your friend?

Talking to anyone is pretty good, so you're not far wrong. A counsellor or therapist has training - think of it as a mental toolkit - to help explore things with you. Depends on their exact approach but most of them wont give advice for example, they will just ask question or reflect what you say back to you to encourage you to figure it out yourself. Or they might look for parallels between your early life and curre…

> Depends on their exact approach but most of them wont give advice for example, they will just ask question

Because general advice is rarely useful in such cases, like you can see in almost all of comments giving advice in this topic. Most of them have at least one "yeah, but in my case...".

Re: Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

#47

Post by yetihehe »

marliechiller wrote: post #29
yetihehe wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"What does it mean to be a good human being" is more general, so a probably a little less easy to answer. With "How to be a good man" you can cater to a smaller group. Women and men have different needs.

Something being more or less generalised doesnt necessarily mean more or less easy to answer. In this instance, its much easier to give axioms to being a good person than it is to being a good man. Especially in this day and age where the very notion of being a man (or woman) is being brought into question.

> Especially in this day and age where the very notion of being a man (or woman) is being brought into question.

Some problems are specific to men or women exactly because our society has different expectations for men and women, so general advice good for one gender is not always good for the other. Example:

Q: How to be more appealing to the other sex?

A: Wear some light makeup and a nice dress.

Re: Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

#48

Post by denton-scratch »

mnky9800n wrote: post #5

Why do people pretend to do therapy to make money? If you can simply open a dude ranch and let people talk in a group during afternoon coffee break, why is that considered legitimate therapy? What's the difference between some dude with a dude ranch and a bachelor's in engineering and organizational psychology calling himself a life coach and someone with a PhD in clinical psychology who put time and energy into stud…

/me not a shrink

The advice I ws given (by a pro) was that if you're thinking of therapy, you need to check out the therapist's credentials. In which tradition(s) were they trained? Are they in therapy themselves? (A therapist with active clients should be in therapy)

I don't think I'd consider group therapy on a dude-ranch run by a cowboy and a "life coach".

Re: Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

#49

Post by cobertos »

ckyngcybra wrote: post #14

[flagged]

Should've read the article. Tbh, this attitude is part of the problem.

To be as hard as the "Marlboro Man" (mentioned in the article) and require complete stoicism seems to have landed people like those described in the article in a place of pain. Not able to reflect on themselves or feel situationally aware.

Re: Do You Need a Visit to the Confident Man Ranch?

#50

Post by TheCoelacanth »

seanhunter wrote: post #25
PlunderBunny wrote: post #4

The smartest thing I read about the question "What does it mean to be a good man?" was that the question was wrong - it should simply be "What does it mean to be a good human being?" In my opinion, it's a much easier question to answer.

Marcus Aurelius wrote something like "Waste no time worrying about what it means to be a good man. Be one."

Doesn't seem like he took his own advice, though.
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