Microsoft plans to kill off NTLM authentication in Windows 11

I'm wondering more about Workgroup networking. I can understand dumping it for domain controllers, but what authentication is used on domain-less networks?

Re: Microsoft plans to kill off NTLM authentication in Windows 11

#5

Post by jeroenhd » Mon, Oct 16, 2023, 3:45 PM UTC

gmiller123456 wrote: post #2

Is this going to break things like SAMBA?

Samba has supported Kerberos for a while. I'm sure there's some IoT shit that will break with NTLM disabled, but I believe maintained servers shouldn't be impacted.

Re: Microsoft plans to kill off NTLM authentication in Windows 11

#6

Post by creeble » Mon, Oct 16, 2023, 3:45 PM UTC

woleium wrote: post #3

gmiller123456 wrote: post #2

Is this going to break things like SAMBA?

Iirc samba preferentially uses Kerberos for auth, falling back to NTLM. I’m sure a lot of folks use NTLM though.

Like just about every home NAS in the world.

Wonder what’s going to happen there?

Re: Microsoft plans to kill off NTLM authentication in Windows 11

#7

Post by ezconnect » Mon, Oct 16, 2023, 3:46 PM UTC

Is the future of windows only online?

Re: Microsoft plans to kill off NTLM authentication in Windows 11

#8

Post by gustavus » Mon, Oct 16, 2023, 3:46 PM UTC

I felt a great disturbance in the force as if thousands of pen-testers and grey hats cried out in agony as their go to means of breaking enterprise networks was lost.

Re: Microsoft plans to kill off NTLM authentication in Windows 11

#9

Post by jeroenhd » Mon, Oct 16, 2023, 3:48 PM UTC

creeble wrote: post #6

woleium wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Iirc samba preferentially uses Kerberos for auth, falling back to NTLM. I’m sure a lot of folks use NTLM though.

Like just about every home NAS in the world. Wonder what’s going to happen there?

The linked article says Microsoft will offer a setting to enable NTLM again. They only seem to be changing the default for now.

My guess is that Windows 11 will disable NTLM out of the box and perhaps Windows 12 will disable it entirely.

Re: Microsoft plans to kill off NTLM authentication in Windows 11

#10

Post by wannacboatmovie » Mon, Oct 16, 2023, 3:50 PM UTC

gmiller123456 wrote: post #2

Is this going to break things like SAMBA?

No. NTLM is an ancient protocol that dates back to Windows NT 3.1 in 1993. That's thirty years ago.

Microsoft has been actively telling customers to "please stop using this" for over 10 years. Enough time has passed.

NTLM is the Telnet of file sharing. There was a time and place for it and that time has passed.