It will probably make the city quieter and cleaner, but wouldn't make it also exclusive for people that can afford an electric car?
Stockholm to ban petrol and diesel cars from centre from 2025
121–130 of 250 posts
Re: Stockholm to ban petrol and diesel cars from centre from 2025
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
It can grow. A few cities started car-free or car polution limiting zones. Every year,the zone grows and the rules get stricter. This way makes it safe to feel the waters, tweak public transports, get people's reaction, without killing it in the cradle.
It's pretty expensive for the city to do that. Tons of signage needs to be removed and replaced with every expansion, and if you choose automated enforcement you need to install lots of new cameras and posts too. Easier to start with one big zone over the whole city, and keep making the requirements stricter automatically. Eg. Take the cars age, add the current year, subtract the cars rated mpg, add 10 if it's a dies…
Loads of towns in the UK have pedestrianised streets going back to the 80s, it's totally doable, and we're pretty car centric.
Re: Stockholm to ban petrol and diesel cars from centre from 2025
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
~50% of Americans are sedentary and obese. They're obviously going to want cars. Walking & cycling are not options (see sedentary).
There are also disabled and elderly people. Try walking and cycling to get your groceries with multiple sclerosis or a couple bad hips. Cars are awesome.
Mobility scooters are not only for the morbidly obese.
Re: Stockholm to ban petrol and diesel cars from centre from 2025
#124In Seattle we still allow cars at pike place market. Talk about stupid
Re: Stockholm to ban petrol and diesel cars from centre from 2025
#125Earlier quoted context omitted.
~50% of Americans are sedentary and obese. They're obviously going to want cars. Walking & cycling are not options (see sedentary).
There are also disabled and elderly people. Try walking and cycling to get your groceries with multiple sclerosis or a couple bad hips. Cars are awesome.
Electric scooters (with seats if need be) are good enough. Moving a ton of metal for errands in city is insane.
Re: Stockholm to ban petrol and diesel cars from centre from 2025
#126I think it's absolutely crazy that our society is OK with car drivers polluting the air with carcinogenic particles. I hope more cities around the world implement similar bans soon.
EVs are not the solution for that, brake and tire wear contribute to as much or more PM2.5 and 2-3 times more PM10 pollution than modern ICEs . Also while there will be some improvement it will be possibly partially outweighed by the fact the EVs generally weight more. Of course we can just ignore that which is not at all crazy... Edit: I'm certainly not using this as argument to not ban ICE vehicles in city centers.…
This is a misleading whataboutism.
EVs use primarily regen for braking, so they contribute almost no brake wear. And that isn't even a problem.
It matters what is emitted. Tire wear particles are relatively large, and don't stay in the air.
Anti-EV disinformation uses the trick of counting pollution by weight, which completely discounts gaseous emissions, which is the real pollution that people breathe in.
Re: Stockholm to ban petrol and diesel cars from centre from 2025
#127Earlier quoted context omitted.
Having lived in some places around Europe, my quality of life is always increased by owning a motor vehicle. I do not use it daily, I do not commute with it, but there are trips which are far more practical with a personal motor vehicle than otherwise, like fetching people from an airport, taking a pet to a vet, driving further out for a hike, hauling groceries.
Maybe some sort of distance-dependent taxation on cars may be a more viable option, so that people can enjoy private commutes when they absolutely need it, while still pushing people towards public transport.
This is what toll roads do, kind of.
Re: Stockholm to ban petrol and diesel cars from centre from 2025
#128Earlier quoted context omitted.
EVs are not the solution for that, brake and tire wear contribute to as much or more PM2.5 and 2-3 times more PM10 pollution than modern ICEs . Also while there will be some improvement it will be possibly partially outweighed by the fact the EVs generally weight more. Of course we can just ignore that which is not at all crazy... Edit: I'm certainly not using this as argument to not ban ICE vehicles in city centers.…
Yeah, the obvious solution is to make smaller lighter vehicles. We’ve built EVs in the image of ICE vehicles, so they’re big and heavy. There are a lot of people who are driving an EV with several hundred miles of range to work less than 20 miles away. That extra order of magnitude of battery capacity is a lot of extra weight. Imagine I’d you could instead rent a battery trailer for those occasional long trips? I thi…
Yes, I wonder which vested interests pushed the whole "range anxiety" and now they benefit from the cars being heavy in that they can point out the pollution.
All cars need to get smaller again, EVs should have automatic charging when parked and when waiting in traffic jams.
EVs are not the solution but they are a stop gap.
Re: Stockholm to ban petrol and diesel cars from centre from 2025
#129Earlier quoted context omitted.
EVs don't use brakes as much as ICE vehicles because of automatic regenerative braking. This converts your forward momentum back into electricity. ICE vehicles use engine braking or brake pads. Both of those are much worse in more ways than one. You might want to cross that off your list of things to complain about when talking about EVs.
The instant torque does blow through tires though. Maybe twice as fast as a typical ICE vehicle? The acceleration on a Tesla is like very, very premium ICE cars that few people have (>300HP). This could easily be tuned out, but that would cripple the thrill, i.e., bad for sales.
Why set your Tesla in Drag strip mode for commuting? It makes zero sense not to set it to Chill https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/modelx/en_us/GUID-43B58CA...
Re: Stockholm to ban petrol and diesel cars from centre from 2025
#130Earlier quoted context omitted.
You obviously don't know Sweden because Amazon is a very small player that just entered the market there and I don't think they make their own deliveries but rather uses already established delivery companies.
Belive me, I know the long story of Amazon and Scandinavia quite well. I took it more general, and used Amazon as proof that last mile deliveries are perfectly possible with EV vans.
I believe you and I think most last mile deliveries already is done with EV vans in Stockholm so maybe that is less of an issue, my answer was mostly a joke anyway.
I have nothing against EVs, in fact the opposite. But it's not the EVs that is the main issue with Stockholm. It's that you don't feel safe travelling in the public transport anymore and they are doing basically nothing to combat it.