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The largest DDoS attack to date, peaking above 398M rps

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Re: The largest DDoS attack to date, peaking above 398M rps

#131

Post by gchamonlive »

seanw444 wrote: post #116
gchamonlive wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What? Let's go back to username and password. 2FA forces scammers to up their game. What about password managers? Having separate passwords to every account makes hacking into your accounts much harder and might hurt everyone in the long run. And don't get me started on end to end encryption. Privacy, long term, will mean the fall of civilization. Sarcasm aside. I think I understand your point in which we shouldn't j…

> Privacy, long term, will mean the fall of civilization. I'm curious about your rationalization for this. Lack of privacy will also mean the fall of civilization. Civilization is just doomed to fail at one point or another. All things come to an end.

This was me being sarcastic. Of course we need privacy, not because we have things to hide, but because individuality can only flourish without constant surveillance.

Yes! All things come to an end and that is why some recent philosophers think that Plato was naive to think it could minimize or erradicate society rotting. This is where negative utilitarianism comes in, where the point of society is not to maximize happiness (and therefore prevent society from collapsing) but to minimize suffering (and therefore provide mechanisms to minimize damages from transitions between organization forms when society collapses). I have to refer you to Karl Popper's The Open Society for this, because needless to say this answer is very reductionist.

Re: The largest DDoS attack to date, peaking above 398M rps

#132

Post by xyst »

oldtownroad wrote: post #5

At a previous company, we were subject to semi-frequent attacks (of a much smaller scale). The operating assumption internally was that it’s a competitor trying to undermine us but it remains a mystery. Anyone involved in these type of attacks (at internet-infrastructure scale or targeting specific companies) brave/crazy enough to create a throwaway account and tell hn about the motivations?

[flagged]

Re: The largest DDoS attack to date, peaking above 398M rps

#133

Post by 6510 »

codedokode wrote: post #80
gchamonlive wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What? Let's go back to username and password. 2FA forces scammers to up their game. What about password managers? Having separate passwords to every account makes hacking into your accounts much harder and might hurt everyone in the long run. And don't get me started on end to end encryption. Privacy, long term, will mean the fall of civilization. Sarcasm aside. I think I understand your point in which we shouldn't j…

There should be a protocol to block traffic on the upstream provider. So if someone from 1.2.3.4 sends lots of traffic at you, you send a special packet to 1.2.3.4 and all upstream providers (including the provider that serves 1.2.0.0/16), that see this packet block traffic from that IP address directed at you. Of course, the packet should allow blocking not only a single address, but a whole network, for example, 1.…

I just imagined this: isp's could make a isp.com?target=yourwebsite.org/fromisp [slow] redirecting url. If you receive unusual amounts of requests from the isp you redirect it though their website.

They can then ignore it until their server melts (which takes care of the problem) or take honorable action if one of their customers is compromised. The S stands for service after all.

Re: The largest DDoS attack to date, peaking above 398M rps

#134

Post by tazjin »

sph wrote: post #8

How does DDoS mitigation work? When people say "I put my website behind Cloudflare to mitigate DDoSes", what does it mean exactly? Is it only about having a large enough ingress pipe that you can weather however many Gb/s you are being bombarded with, and still having some spare capacity for legitimate traffic?

Back when I was in Google SRE, people would joke that "we just send DDoS traffic to Australia".

In general, Google's internal cross-DC traffic is so much larger than anything anyone could DDoS them with that they can always find a way to deal with it.

Re: The largest DDoS attack to date, peaking above 398M rps

#135

Post by ilyt »

OsrsNeedsf2P wrote: post #6
oldtownroad wrote: post #5

At a previous company, we were subject to semi-frequent attacks (of a much smaller scale). The operating assumption internally was that it’s a competitor trying to undermine us but it remains a mystery. Anyone involved in these type of attacks (at internet-infrastructure scale or targeting specific companies) brave/crazy enough to create a throwaway account and tell hn about the motivations?

We had a similar issue and assumed it was script kiddies having fun. Turns out someone (raises hand) wrote a really bad microservice who's inefficient queries sometimes triggered all our alerts.

We had that except it was our own frontend developers.

We also had some actual attacks so we made a system that detect anomalies (like more than 50rps per IP) and raises alert.

...which was thwarted by frontend developers again, as they loaded few hundred tiny icons at once that triggered that alert routinely, and only thru http2 multiplexing their idiotic design patents haven't bitten them before.

Re: The largest DDoS attack to date, peaking above 398M rps

#137

Post by ilyt »

dudeinjapan wrote: post #33
falcor84 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Made me wonder - if Google wasn't there and Altavista was the incumbent, would it be any different, or was the enshittification of search inevitable?

Was at Tokyo Disneyland today and taught my girlfriend the word “enshittification”. (i.e. making your customers pay via your stupid app to do literally anything in your park, and not even providing wi-fi.)

So you taught her wrong, that's not what it means...

Re: The largest DDoS attack to date, peaking above 398M rps

#138

Post by ComodoHacker »

codedokode wrote: post #115
alexfoo wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simple! To prevent it being abused easily you could make it so you would need to send a high number of those packets for a sustained period in order to activate the block.

You can only block access to your IP address, so you can ban someone from sending packets to you but not to anyone else. My proposal is well-thought and doesn't require any lists like Spamhaus that have vague policies for inclusion and charge money for removing. My proposal doesn't have any potential for misuse.

How can it protect from... botnets, where there are tens of thousands "someones"?

Re: The largest DDoS attack to date, peaking above 398M rps

#140

Post by sschueller »

papichulo2023 wrote: post #129
sph wrote: post #8

How does DDoS mitigation work? When people say "I put my website behind Cloudflare to mitigate DDoSes", what does it mean exactly? Is it only about having a large enough ingress pipe that you can weather however many Gb/s you are being bombarded with, and still having some spare capacity for legitimate traffic?

I always believed that they have some secret mega routers with massive computation limits that allows smart and complex tcp/udp packages filtering.

They do have special equipment at the edges like: https://www.netscout.com/arbor
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