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Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

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Re: Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

#111
post #15

Texas has an amendment coming up for vote next month to allow municipalities to cut property tax on properties used for child care. Was a pleasant surprise to see real good incentives tied to a change.

This isn't as bad as it sounds. Not sure what the rules in TX are, but in CA child care is a business, meaning you have to run it like one. Homeschooling one own's children isn't going to meet this definition, so only bonafide businesses should qualify for this.

I suspect that there is a lot of (not really) grey area here. My impression is that many homeschoolers wind up working with other people, so at least some of the time they have other people's kids in their home. It would be fairly easy to brand this as a small business, argue a tax loss, and take deductions on part of your home.

And there are a lot of similarly shady deductions out there. I had a co-worker whose wife was a dentist and owned her own practice. He was telling me about how great it was that they were able to expense her car every time they bought her a new one. But when I asked: the only business use of it she has is to drive back and forth to the office. She never drives to other work locations with it, and including that commute, all of her uses of it are personal (commutes are not business expenses). When I pointed out that this means that it can't be a business expense (my wife was taking a tax course at the time), he insisted that all of her dentist friends did the same, and that it was "standard practice".

Re: Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

#112

Universal childcare is low-hanging fruit for America. Unfortunately, there is a vocal section (mostly married men) who want a stay-at-home mom and believe this will, similar to women entering the workforce following the advent of contraception and the civil rights movement, "force" their wives into the workplace.

Do you think my preference for my wife to be a homemaker is wrong or irrelevant? It's not just an arbitrary preference: in general it is better for the children. It is also what most mothers (at least mothers of young children) would prefer, including my wife.

Don't get me wrong: for some children, childcare is a better alternative than what awaits them at home, but I think for most it produces worse outcomes.

And this kind of thing will force some women into the workforce, because there's no free lunch and some women will have to work to offset the cost to pay for these programs.

Re: Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

#113

The argument no one has brought up yet: why should society have to pay up even more for breeders' personal choices? People without kids have to pay higher taxes (via rebates for parents), utilize less resources (public schools), effectively subsidizing people who want to have kids. I'm all for protecting what's best for children, but I am not happy with people having children they cannot adequately support, causing o…

I understand where you are coming from. I am curious though if you feel differently after watching this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBudghsdByQ (I did)

I knew exactly which video you linked before I even clicked on it. Very timely! (Why Korea is Dying Out - Kurzgesagt – In a Nutshell)

Re: Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

#114
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Universal Childcare at the margin means some people who would rather take care of their own children are pushed to take a job and have someone else watch their child. I fail to see why that's superior to a universal childcare subsidy, which can be used for childcare or retained if someone wishes to care for their child themself. Or better yet, a universal child allowance that parents can use to defray whatever child…

> some people who would rather take care of their own children are pushed to take a job and have someone else watch their child You could say the same about the taxes used to pay for public schools. > fail to see why that's superior to a universal childcare subsidy For one, it doesn't free up labor. Two, most systems I'm aware of let one take a childcare subsidy and use it at home. Paying providers by default makes a…

> You could say the same about the taxes used to pay for public schools.

Absolutely, because it is true. Especially considering how much we overpay for public schools (costs having been rising faster than inflation for decades with no improvement in student outcomes).

Re: Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

#115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

property tax is a burden for anyone who owns property in the US.

The weight of my t-shirt upon my shoulders is also technically a burden. Who cares. Quantitative distinctions matter, binary burden/non-burden thinking is not helpful.

unless the weight of your t-shirt is a cause for great worry, it's not a burden.

Re: Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

#116
post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> from the south and have never once heard anything like this I should have added that I've typically heard it in liberal suburbs, not rural America. Good, recent example is this thread [1] right here on HN (in particular this comment [2]). [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37654342 . [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37654578

The thing about women entering the workforce making it impossible to have a single earner home is nonsense. The problem is housing. Most things are the same price or cheaper as a percentage of median income today except housing. That’s because housing is treated as investment meant to appreciate, leading to perverse incentives to artificially restrict supply. IMHO housing is the economic problem in the Western world.…

Housing isn't the only aspect, by far. Our family healthcare insurance premium is double our mortgage, and it goes up more than inflation (and wage growth) every year.

Re: Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

#117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't disagree, but there does exist a network of people who run childcare services for the public out of their homes. I imagine this is who benefits from the amendment.

If this gets us further from a land value tax, it is bad. Simple as. 100% this is disguised handout for home schooling right wing nuts. Property tax is not a significant burden for regular childcare outfits. "Cash poor asset rich" is not a real problem and anyone telling you otherwise it out to swindle you.

[dead]

Re: Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

#118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This right here is why we can't get anything done. Republicans say that the poor will benefit so we can't give them money. The center-right will say we can't do that, the rich might benefit, we can't give them money. So what happens is the rich get all the money. Stop putting means testing garbage on these bills. It only means those who need the assistance on the edge will be denied.

Someone had a comment about Clinton's reflexive criticism of Sanders free college tuition plan, that it was a give away to upper middle class students. Reality upper class and upper middle class students get free tuition from their parents. Taxing wealthy parents and giving some of the money back to their kids as free tuition isn't really a freebee. They also pointed out the wealthy fret that their kids are growing u…

> Reality upper class and upper middle class students get free tuition from their parents

Yes, they get free tuition from their parents which is why they don’t need government assistance for college. We don’t give food stamps to millionaires either.

Re: Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

#119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No that's like antithetical to the entire concept of taxes in general and their use for all. Government services are not a market and should not be. We pay for everyone's schooling because educated people make a better democracy. If you decide the public system isn't for you, why should you have any entitlement to not continue to pay for everyone else's children like everyone else?

The US tax provided school system doesn't seem to do a great job at educating. Why should we support a broken system?

because simply stopping to support it and running off to do your own thing is going to make it worse. what is needed is more funding and a push for reform.

Re: Kentucky made child care free for child care workers

#120
post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> from the south and have never once heard anything like this I should have added that I've typically heard it in liberal suburbs, not rural America. Good, recent example is this thread [1] right here on HN (in particular this comment [2]). [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37654342 . [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37654578

The thing about women entering the workforce making it impossible to have a single earner home is nonsense. The problem is housing. Most things are the same price or cheaper as a percentage of median income today except housing. That’s because housing is treated as investment meant to appreciate, leading to perverse incentives to artificially restrict supply. IMHO housing is the economic problem in the Western world.…

> The thing about women entering the workforce making it impossible to have a single earner home is nonsense. The problem is housing.

I think you may be right about the overall problem, but I'm not sure I agree that density is the solution.

People starting families don't just want a house, what they want is enough space. Mothers want a yard they can send the kids out into when they need a moments peace, closets to store everyone's junk, and bathrooms big enough to walk into while pregnant.

I think disaggregating populations into more medium and small cities would help keep costs down and give people more space.

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