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The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

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Re: The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

#341

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And media companies...

Especially the media companies! They put artificial limits on the range of acceptable thoughts, acting as both a muzzle and a noose around the neck of the public.

Yes because there is absolutely no way for you to get your thoughts to people worldwide without depending on big media…

Re: The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

#342
post #99

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Here are some possibilities (not claiming these are practical or a solution): The first is splitting Amazon-retail from their other products (Alexa, Ring, AWS, etc.) The second is splitting Amazon-logistics out. I'm not exactly sure how this would work, but it could be argued that Amazon logistics could operate standalone.

The latter seems plausible to me, but the former makes no sense. If the problem is that Amazon-retail has too much market power, how would splitting off AWS help with that problem? Amazon-retail would still have the same fraction of the retail market as before.

Exactly, people here who shout “break them up”, don’t put an ounce of thought into it.

Re: The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

#343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When Facebook was founded there was no Facebook. Now there is a Facebook. When there's a better alternative customers are less likely to try out your new, less good idea. Can you give an example of someone serious using IPFS instead of S3? I don't really get what "all storage worldwide" means.

Except there was a Facebook and it was called MySpace. Facebook won because people enjoyed using it better.

yes, but the bar for better was much lower back then. if you released the original Facebook today it would be so obviously so much worse than the competitors it wouldn't get any traction.

Re: The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

#344

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can repeat that comment here as many times as you want but it will not make it a valid one. Amazon is practically a monopoly, and they have reached that position by often selling goods below COG prices, incurring losses but outliving the competition. Now without a competitive marketplace for quite a lot of stuff they can dictate the prices at a loss for everyone except them. If somebody was to challenge them with…

Amazon isn't a monopoly by any definition. There are plenty of places to buy things. Repeating it over and over again won't change reality. Feel free to bookmark this and come back to it 10 years from now. Amazon won't be broken up, either. Customers are so lazy they want the government do everything for them. If you don't like Amazon, close the tab and go to eBay.com or Walmart.com. It's very easy, and can be done i…

> Amazon isn't a monopoly by any definition.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/monopoly "For instance, the term monopoly may be referring to instances where: [...] There are many buyers or sellers, but one actor has enough market share to dictate prices (near monopolies)"

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I'm not replying to anything you might reply with because the rest of your comments in this thread have clearly been in bad faith. But this was one of the few smoking gun comments betraying either a biased position you hold or your lack of background on the topic, so it was easy enough to just post a link to an authoritative source + definition and just move on.

Re: The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

#345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, to be clear, you have no problem with Amazon writing their own laws and collecting their own taxes? Because that is what they are effectively doing.

If sellers were obligated to sell on Amazon that would be the case, but it's not, is it? Ironically, people complaining about this are exacerbating the issue. If sellers who actually cared left Amazon it would loosen Amazon's dominance in e-commerce.

Sellers are in effect obligated to sell on Amazon, because the alternative is “go out of business”. That’s the whole goddamn point of FTC intervention.

Re: The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

#346

I’m not sure I agree with the opening premise that offering “free shipping” is dangling a free lunch that doesn’t exist. Technically this is true but it makes a lot of sense by creating an analogous experience as with retail. If I walk to the corner store to pick up something I’m not paying a line item for the logistics that delivered that item from a factory in China, nor a line item for the rent to keep that item s…

Offering free shipping is not a problem. The problem is that mandating your suppliers subsidize free shipping and don't sell for cheaper prices elsewhere is blatantly anticompetitive, and has the effect of raising consumer prices on non-Amazon markets.

I agree with that, and I think buy box suppression should be stopped. I’m just responding to the opening paragraphs of the link (and some near the end) where the author appears to be arguing against the very conception of free shipping as if it’s something that can only be offered in distorted and monopolistic markets.

Re: The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

#347

What does breaking up Amazon look like? I’m genuinely curious because half the comments I see in here are “break up Amazon!” or “break up FAANG!” What does that look like? What would Amazon look like if broken up? In the end we all know lobbyists from Amazon will somehow influence their outcome.

Amazon marketplace, AWS, Whole Foods, Twitch, Fulfillment by Amazon, and maybe Amazon Studios could all be separate companies. I think Amazon marketplace would also be forced to end some practices like not allowing sellers to have lower prices elsewhere.

Yes, because Amazon owning Whole Foods is keeping other grocery stores from competing and offering a lower price?

And Amazon Studios is do successful it must be broken up.

Not to mention if AWS was broken up from Amazon smaller competitors could come in an offer cloud services distributed world wide at scale.

Have you really thought about how useless these suggestions are?

Re: The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

#348

An excerpt from: https://pluralistic.net/2023/04/25/greedflation/ Amazon binds its sellers over to something called Most Favored Nation status. That means that sellers can't offer their goods more cheaply than they do on Amazon – even if it costs them (lots) less to sell in Target or direct from their websites. This means that every time a seller adds a dollar to their Amazon sale price, they have to add a dollar to…

This sort of practice is not as uncommon as one might assume.

It is extremely common for manufacturers to set a minimum advertised price (MAP) on the products they sell to retailers. This is done to keep the cost of, say, luxury goods above a certain value, or to ensure that even if demand falls off for a product, the product is sold from official channels at a price point that covers the raw-materials-plus-labor cost so the manufacturer isn't fundamentally selling at a loss. These agreements are generally enforced by both contract and tit-for-tat... Sometimes there are contractually-encoded penalties for going under-MAP, but sometimes the agreement is more "off the books..." If Amazon decides those Gucci purses are just taking up warehouse space and slashes their price to clear them, they can do that... If they don't want to have any Gucci purses to sell next year through official channels.

Why is this behavior legal for manufacturers but maybe not for Amazon? I can see no other reason than the law is path-dependent and arbitrary. "Fair trade" is a concept we invent as we go.

(Incidentally... As a consumer, it's useful to remember MAP exists when you hear whispers of "don't buy from unauthorized resellers." Sometimes the goods you get from those channels are shady, but sometimes they're exactly the same as the official-goods channels, shoveled into the back channel by an official retailer to clear warehouse space and reported to the manufacturer as 'damaged, lost' to preserve the MAP kayfabe).

Re: The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

#349

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They can say "thanks to all my supporters". it's just fallacy to think the creator actually cares. it's a simple copy&paste from a list from their patreon (or whatever) to the text editor of their editing software. it's even less if they aren't even the ones doing the editing. sure, they all say "we love our supporters". it's just like people that donate to NPR so they can have their names read out over the air. how…

> They can say "thanks to all my supporters". it's just fallacy to think the creator actually cares. How deeply cynical and also, besides the point; even if you believe all creators don't give a shit (I believe many do), people still like being thanked. I mean, clearly you don't ...

what you call cynical, I call naive on your part. We clearly have different opinions on creators and their level of sincerity towards supporters. i hold them just this side of influencers. i understand that they may depend on the support, but it's not like adding someone's name on a screen for .5 seconds means "they care about me". it just means they're fulfilling some obligation they used to entice people to donate. people that decide "because my name will be on the video for .5s" is what pushes to donate is beyond silly.

Re: The FTC sues to break up Amazon over an economy-wide “hidden tax”

#350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read that, on average, Amazon collects 50% of the cost in fees; from sellers.

And how much do you think traditional retail marks up prices from wholesale to retail?

Why is that relevant?
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