Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It • Hacker News Board

Re: Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It

#91

Post by mikestew » Mon, Oct 02, 2023, 4:05 PM UTC

dinkblam wrote: post #33

grumblingdev wrote: post #20

Video conf still sucks. It's literally the same as 10 years ago. Does anyone have a workplace where it is really seamless, high resolution, and just works? Or is using any of these new technologies? Maybe VR will help... But not being in-person for collaboration/morale is miles apart. I wonder if employees would personally cover the cost of a one week meetup once per month if their other option was move city and offi…

> Video conf still sucks Audio calls also still suck. Commercials in the 90s advertised "crystal clear audio quality" - they stopped talking about it but it never materialised.

Audio calls are fine on FaceTime and Teams (and, I suspect, most other products). But if you and (especially) your team are still talking to your screen instead of using a real headset, then yeah, the quality is going to suck. One doesn't need use the pricey headset and mic I normally use for music production, just something that doesn't have the software DSP constantly trying to filter out background noise while still picking up your voice.

But if you're referring to cell calls, yeah, we lost a lot of quality when we ditched landlines.

Re: Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It

#92

Post by brewdad » Mon, Oct 02, 2023, 4:05 PM UTC

deemster wrote: post #32

mattlondon wrote: post #10

Its only bullshit if you want to work remote. I want to be in the office. Working remote is the most stressful thing I've ever done.

If you're willing to share, why was working remote the most stressful thing you've ever done?

Not OP, but not everyone has an ideal environment to work from home. They might be in a small apartment with two adults trying to both get work done without disturbing the other. They might have young children that need full-time supervision.

They could leave to find a coffee shop or something similar to work from but not everyone enjoys working in that type of environment or has a job where that would be appropriate. My wife, for example, works on things that require a security clearance and are on a years long secretive development cycle. Having those conversations overheard in a public space could be problematic. By the time you get to the point of renting a workspace to get a little privacy, you might as well let your employer pay for it and go back to the office.

Re: Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It

#93

Post by giancarlostoro » Mon, Oct 02, 2023, 4:05 PM UTC

virtuous_sloth wrote: post #56

ramraj07 wrote: post #34

If I start a company tomorrow, this is what I would want to do: 1. Hire within a general metropolitan area (2 hour commute max). 2. WFH for 28 days a month. 3. 2 days a month the entire org convenes in a ballroom or something and works together, have some progress reports, happy hours and hackathons. In this model, everyone’s remote most of the time. Yet everyone gets FaceTime with each other IrL. Seed ideas and brai…

You'd require people to work 30 days per month?

I think they meant, if you're going to work at all throughout the entire month, only 2 days would be onsite, the rest are WFH.

Re: Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It

#94

Post by kjkjadksj » Mon, Oct 02, 2023, 4:05 PM UTC

Fyrezerk wrote: post #55

mysterydip wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes it stressful? I haven't seen this take before so I'm really curious about this perspective.

I know several friends who prefer to be in the office because they need some amount of time away from their young kids. It's the equivalent of "them" time where they get an escape from child care for a few hours.

Where is the kid then when they are at the office? Probably in childcare then not left alone with a stove if they are at the bug you all day age. You can put them in childcare wile working remote too.

Re: Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It

#95

Post by robohoe » Mon, Oct 02, 2023, 4:05 PM UTC

grumblingdev wrote: post #20

Video conf still sucks. It's literally the same as 10 years ago. Does anyone have a workplace where it is really seamless, high resolution, and just works? Or is using any of these new technologies? Maybe VR will help... But not being in-person for collaboration/morale is miles apart. I wonder if employees would personally cover the cost of a one week meetup once per month if their other option was move city and offi…

It's even worse when you have to go into the office just to sit all day on video calls with people that are remote.

Re: Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It

#96

Post by scottLobster » Mon, Oct 02, 2023, 4:05 PM UTC

mysterydip wrote: post #28

mattlondon wrote: post #10

Its only bullshit if you want to work remote. I want to be in the office. Working remote is the most stressful thing I've ever done.

What makes it stressful? I haven't seen this take before so I'm really curious about this perspective.

As a father of a 1 year old, my focus is immediately broken when she's throwing a fit or even just making unusual noises moving around, even if I rationally know my wife is taking care of it and she's probably just crawling around. I get twice as much done at the office.

Re: Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It

#97

Post by tedivm » Mon, Oct 02, 2023, 4:06 PM UTC

bhouston wrote: post #47

I think that many people struggle at home (group A) while others don't (group B). RTO helps those who struggle at home (group A). And is a major inconvenience to those who excelled at home (group B) but it doesn't significantly degrade them. Thus RTO improves group A performance while not affecting group B performance so it looks like a win overall and in a sense it is. But it is penalizing group B, making their live…

This seems like a lot of conjecture without any numbers or facts to back it up. You assume that making Group B return to office won't affect their productivity, while making Group A work from home will. However, I know for me personally I'm far more productive when I work from home. I know I'm not the only one where this is the case. Forcing me into the office would drop my productivity considerably.

Re: Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It

#98

Post by function_seven » Mon, Oct 02, 2023, 4:06 PM UTC

ledauphin wrote: post #73

ramraj07 wrote: post #34

If I start a company tomorrow, this is what I would want to do: 1. Hire within a general metropolitan area (2 hour commute max). 2. WFH for 28 days a month. 3. 2 days a month the entire org convenes in a ballroom or something and works together, have some progress reports, happy hours and hackathons. In this model, everyone’s remote most of the time. Yet everyone gets FaceTime with each other IrL. Seed ideas and brai…

critique: (almost) no one wants to work 30 days a month. ;) more seriously: I assume you plan to pay for hotel rooms? also: why 2 hours max? If you're paying for one night in a hotel, then surely you could pay for 2 nights, making 3 or more hours feasible.

The 2 hours max is so no hotel room is needed. Two hours would be a hellish commute if it were every day, but it’s no big deal only two days a month.

Re: Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It

#99

Post by giancarlostoro » Mon, Oct 02, 2023, 4:06 PM UTC

ledauphin wrote: post #73

ramraj07 wrote: post #34

If I start a company tomorrow, this is what I would want to do: 1. Hire within a general metropolitan area (2 hour commute max). 2. WFH for 28 days a month. 3. 2 days a month the entire org convenes in a ballroom or something and works together, have some progress reports, happy hours and hackathons. In this model, everyone’s remote most of the time. Yet everyone gets FaceTime with each other IrL. Seed ideas and brai…

critique: (almost) no one wants to work 30 days a month. ;) more seriously: I assume you plan to pay for hotel rooms? also: why 2 hours max? If you're paying for one night in a hotel, then surely you could pay for 2 nights, making 3 or more hours feasible.

So you don't have to fly people in.

Re: Return to Office Is Bullshit and Everyone Knows It

#100

Post by ckbishop » Mon, Oct 02, 2023, 4:06 PM UTC

ramraj07 wrote: post #34

If I start a company tomorrow, this is what I would want to do: 1. Hire within a general metropolitan area (2 hour commute max). 2. WFH for 28 days a month. 3. 2 days a month the entire org convenes in a ballroom or something and works together, have some progress reports, happy hours and hackathons. In this model, everyone’s remote most of the time. Yet everyone gets FaceTime with each other IrL. Seed ideas and brai…

Yeah, as soon as I see that 2 days a month thing, I'm not applying for the position. That's my only critique.