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Tesla sued for severe harassment of black workers at California plant

theguardian.com

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Re: Tesla sued for severe harassment of black workers at California plant

#41

Post by padjo »

racked wrote: post #29
thereare5lights wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not even the worse part. The refusal to make a change that costs you nothing in order to stick it to people you don't like is much worse and indicates all sorts of behaviors you do not want on your team.

It really is not about that. The problem is that some people feel the need to bend over backwards, making symbolic gestures that do not change the underlying issue. As if renaming 'whitelist' to 'allowlist' is going to turn any neo-nazis into angels. George Carlin had a word or two to say about this phenomenon: https://youtu.be/hSp8IyaKCs0

I don’t think the idea is to convert neo-nazis. People feel pretty powerless to help fight racism and doing small things like this help them feel a bit better.

Also, changing language that explicitly says “white good”, “black bad” can’t really hurt. It takes very little effort and “allow list” is actually clearer anyway.

Re: Tesla sued for severe harassment of black workers at California plant

#42

Post by roenxi »

sleiben wrote: post #40
racked wrote: post #13

[flagged]

The «master» to «main» change was totally unnecessary and B.S. imho. Even 15 years ago, when I started my professional journey (in Germany) there were a lot of people who were gay, trans and so on in the dev community … and nobody cared about it. We were all passioned about technologies and respected each other based on commitment/engagement/skill level. At the end most of the true full blood developers were always «…

But it is also a technical improvement. main is easier to type.

It takes a lot of effort to overcome the inertia of a default, so even if the reasoning is a bit suspect the outcome is going to be a win eventually.

Re: Tesla sued for severe harassment of black workers at California plant

#43

Post by [deleted] »

thereare5lights wrote: post #21
tomlockwood wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

That's not even the worse part. The refusal to make a change that costs you nothing in order to stick it to people you don't like is much worse and indicates all sorts of behaviors you do not want on your team.

[deleted]

Re: Tesla sued for severe harassment of black workers at California plant

#44

Post by [deleted] »

thereare5lights wrote: post #21
tomlockwood wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

That's not even the worse part. The refusal to make a change that costs you nothing in order to stick it to people you don't like is much worse and indicates all sorts of behaviors you do not want on your team.

[deleted]

Re: Tesla sued for severe harassment of black workers at California plant

#45

Post by tticvs »

padjo wrote: post #41
racked wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really is not about that. The problem is that some people feel the need to bend over backwards, making symbolic gestures that do not change the underlying issue. As if renaming 'whitelist' to 'allowlist' is going to turn any neo-nazis into angels. George Carlin had a word or two to say about this phenomenon: https://youtu.be/hSp8IyaKCs0

I don’t think the idea is to convert neo-nazis. People feel pretty powerless to help fight racism and doing small things like this help them feel a bit better. Also, changing language that explicitly says “white good”, “black bad” can’t really hurt. It takes very little effort and “allow list” is actually clearer anyway.

But it does hurt since it equates anti-racism with meaningless nonsense therefore directly undermining the purported cause.

Unless of course the real motivation isn't to help but instead to demonstrate power and status...

Re: Tesla sued for severe harassment of black workers at California plant

#46

Post by PH95VuimJjqBqy »

thereare5lights wrote: post #21
tomlockwood wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

That's not even the worse part. The refusal to make a change that costs you nothing in order to stick it to people you don't like is much worse and indicates all sorts of behaviors you do not want on your team.

> That's not even the worse part.

I was mentally and physically abused as a child by my stepfather.

If, in the middle of him choking me unconscious someone had given me the choice between "lots of people tell him he's horrible" and "someone gets him off of me", which do you think I would choose?

Do you think those who are disadvantaged due to their race would rather you worry about helping them get on their feet or not hiring someone for not wanting to name a branch "main".

You add to the hurt of this world in the name of victims who would rather you do something more useful. This is about you, not about them.

Re: Tesla sued for severe harassment of black workers at California plant

#47

Post by iakov »

roenxi wrote: post #42
sleiben wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The «master» to «main» change was totally unnecessary and B.S. imho. Even 15 years ago, when I started my professional journey (in Germany) there were a lot of people who were gay, trans and so on in the dev community … and nobody cared about it. We were all passioned about technologies and respected each other based on commitment/engagement/skill level. At the end most of the true full blood developers were always «…

But it is also a technical improvement. main is easier to type. It takes a lot of effort to overcome the inertia of a default, so even if the reasoning is a bit suspect the outcome is going to be a win eventually.

This is such a silly argument. Let’s call it “m” then - it’s even easier to type, so should be an even bigger win, right? Thousands of scripts and workflows be damned.

Re: Tesla sued for severe harassment of black workers at California plant

#48

Post by Akronymus »

makeitdouble wrote: post #34
olalonde wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really feels like the US has been regressing in recent years when it comes to racism. A lot of the hard-won progress is seemingly dissipating.

It think it comes in waves. There's a phase of progress and real social changes, laws get passed to correct past issues, the media warms up a lot towards minorities etc. Then comes the reaction, as too much visible change happens, opposing groups organize and try to re-anchor their position, will push as hard a possible to undo some of the progress and carve out areas where they'll be able to protect their values. I…

IMO the newest wave of racism stems from the blowback to racist policies like affirmative action and similar. (for example, stipends only gor certain races and such)

Re: Tesla sued for severe harassment of black workers at California plant

#50

Post by [deleted] »

thereare5lights wrote: post #21
tomlockwood wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

That's not even the worse part. The refusal to make a change that costs you nothing in order to stick it to people you don't like is much worse and indicates all sorts of behaviors you do not want on your team.

[deleted]
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