Burnout is caused by resentment • Hacker News Board

Re: Burnout is caused by resentment

#21

Post by tumblen » Wed, Mar 28, 2012, 11:23 PM UTC

j_baker wrote: post #9

Jabbles wrote: post #6

What are the average work hours per week and days' holiday a year taken by a (US) Googler?

I don't know that there's really that much data on the subject (and if there is, I probably wouldn't be able to disclose it). I will say this though: I've never been asked to work long hours. Nor have I ever been assigned enough work that I've had to work long hours. We tend to not have fixed deadlines, so it's rare that I have to work in crunch mode. Some people love their jobs and work at all hours. Google is more…

What is Google's alternative to fixed deadlines? (Really, really curious about this.)

Re: Burnout is caused by resentment

#22

Post by andrewcooke » Wed, Mar 28, 2012, 11:32 PM UTC

no - resentment leads to "being pissed-off enough to go work somewhere else".

please, lets keep "burnout" for burning out. you know: when you're in a foetal ball sobbing, begging for it to stop; when you need years before your work is enjoyable again; when the client liaison goes on leave after an "accident" with a knife.

there is a difference between that and "resentment".

Re: Burnout is caused by resentment

#23

Post by eshvk » Wed, Mar 28, 2012, 11:34 PM UTC

debacle wrote: post #12

j_baker wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know that there's really that much data on the subject (and if there is, I probably wouldn't be able to disclose it). I will say this though: I've never been asked to work long hours. Nor have I ever been assigned enough work that I've had to work long hours. We tend to not have fixed deadlines, so it's rare that I have to work in crunch mode. Some people love their jobs and work at all hours. Google is more…

What's Google's understanding on working from home / telecommuting? I'm more than willing to work long hours, but I find I'm much happier when I'm sshed in from home than sitting at my desk thinking about my kids.

My friend works for Google and I have definitely seen him work from home. I am not sure whether they would be okay with doing remote (you would have to ask them) but I am sure if you knock off early and logged on from home and got your stuff done, no one would care.

Re: Burnout is caused by resentment

#24

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Mar 29, 2012, 12:24 AM UTC

makmanalp wrote: post #19

j_baker wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know that there's really that much data on the subject (and if there is, I probably wouldn't be able to disclose it). I will say this though: I've never been asked to work long hours. Nor have I ever been assigned enough work that I've had to work long hours. We tend to not have fixed deadlines, so it's rare that I have to work in crunch mode. Some people love their jobs and work at all hours. Google is more…

The interesting thing about a culture where the long work day is more common than not is that it starts becoming an expectation even though it isn't codified in any rule. So for example you'd be less likely to get a raise or promotion than a person who puts in more hours than the required. So even though you're not abusing the company you get less benefits for doing the amount of work you're getting paid for.

[deleted]

Re: Burnout is caused by resentment

#25

Post by AsylumWarden » Thu, Mar 29, 2012, 12:24 AM UTC

tumblen wrote: post #21

j_baker wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know that there's really that much data on the subject (and if there is, I probably wouldn't be able to disclose it). I will say this though: I've never been asked to work long hours. Nor have I ever been assigned enough work that I've had to work long hours. We tend to not have fixed deadlines, so it's rare that I have to work in crunch mode. Some people love their jobs and work at all hours. Google is more…

What is Google's alternative to fixed deadlines? (Really, really curious about this.)

I'm going with "Beta" and "Labs" as alternatives to fixed deadlines. I think I shall even start including these in the names of my own projects to alleviate those pesky deadlines.

Edit: Hey! My first post! Go me! BTW, this post was beta.

Re: Burnout is caused by resentment

#26

Post by Agathos » Thu, Mar 29, 2012, 12:31 AM UTC

cletus wrote: post #20

At the risk of making everything about Google... I'm going to talk about Google (with the disclaimer that I've now worked here for only ~1.5 years so I'm not authority, etc etc). stcredzero mentions a laundry list of soul-sapping bad behaviour and in previous jobs I've suffered through (or quit over) probably all of them at one time or another. There are some subtle yet fundamentally important differences in how Goog…

> you feel like you owe it to them for taking such incredibly good care of you.

As a recovering academic, I felt a twinge of horror when I read this. When I didn't love the work I pushed on mainly out of guilt, and it was more than I could carry after a while. Maybe I should have tried resentment.

Re: Burnout is caused by resentment

#27

Post by j_baker » Thu, Mar 29, 2012, 12:36 AM UTC

tumblen wrote: post #21

j_baker wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know that there's really that much data on the subject (and if there is, I probably wouldn't be able to disclose it). I will say this though: I've never been asked to work long hours. Nor have I ever been assigned enough work that I've had to work long hours. We tend to not have fixed deadlines, so it's rare that I have to work in crunch mode. Some people love their jobs and work at all hours. Google is more…

What is Google's alternative to fixed deadlines? (Really, really curious about this.)

Google's alternative is to not have fixed deadlines. I'm not sure there's really much else to say there. :-)

For the most part, Google's philosophy is "Hire smart people and get out of their way." Granted, there's an ever-growing list of exceptions to the "get out of their way" part. In short, there are very few circumstances where a manager will tell you "You have to launch by..." If you and your team want to set a hard ship date, then you can do it. If you want to say "It'll be done when it's done", you can probably do that too. Granted, every product area and team will tend to have their own quirks, but that's the "corporate position".

Re: Burnout is caused by resentment

#28

Post by tensor » Thu, Mar 29, 2012, 12:38 AM UTC

joezydeco wrote: post #10

paulhauggis wrote: post #3

I agree with this. My problem is that I have a big problem sacrificing my free time for my regular paycheck while the boss makes potentially millions.

Hey, that boss isn't taking home a paycheck like you are, so suck it up.

Offer your boss to work completely for free in exchange for equity then. I wonder if anyone has tried this and what the response was.

Re: Burnout is caused by resentment

#29

Post by philh » Thu, Mar 29, 2012, 12:48 AM UTC

MrFoof wrote: post #2

I'd agree. Every time I've quit, it's because I felt I was repeatedly getting the short end of the stick, and management was expecting me to roll over every time I brought such things up. I quit my first job at 15 1/2. I worked at a Wal-Mart during the summer to buy a computer. I covered 200% more departments than I was hired for. I never took a day off, despite coworkers just not showing up so they could go to the b…

What you describe isn't burnout though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burnout_(psychology)

Re: Burnout is caused by resentment

#30

Post by boofar » Thu, Mar 29, 2012, 12:49 AM UTC

Most here have commented 3-4 hours ago, but 2 hours ago Isaac Yonemoto left an excellent comment on the blog. So if you read this message, because you're checking the thread for new discussion, I encourage you to check out his comment as well. :-)