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FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

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Re: FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

#41

Post by snickerbockers »

JohnTHaller wrote: post #6
cddotdotslash wrote: post #4

One of the biggest arguments I remember being made back when net neutrality was a hot topic was that ISPs would bundle and sell specific websites as tiered plans. Infographics like this one [1] were shared widely. Has this happened in the US? I’ve definitely seen ISPs start to apply data caps and throttling, but haven’t seen the aforementioned packaging (at least with the major ISPs). I ask because this is one of the…

We have gotten it, but with services not websites. Mobile providers will sell you an "Unlimited" data plan that throttles everything after 25GB a month. Streaming Spotify and Apple Music won't count against that soft data cap. Streaming other music services will count against it. Video streaming over YouTube, Netflix, etc is capped at 480p levels. If you pay an additional monthly fee, you get upgraded to "Unlimited P…

Is this worse than the pre-NN system where they would just throttle everything after 25GB/month with no exceptions?

Re: FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

#42

Post by brightball »

JohnTHaller wrote: post #6
cddotdotslash wrote: post #4

One of the biggest arguments I remember being made back when net neutrality was a hot topic was that ISPs would bundle and sell specific websites as tiered plans. Infographics like this one [1] were shared widely. Has this happened in the US? I’ve definitely seen ISPs start to apply data caps and throttling, but haven’t seen the aforementioned packaging (at least with the major ISPs). I ask because this is one of the…

We have gotten it, but with services not websites. Mobile providers will sell you an "Unlimited" data plan that throttles everything after 25GB a month. Streaming Spotify and Apple Music won't count against that soft data cap. Streaming other music services will count against it. Video streaming over YouTube, Netflix, etc is capped at 480p levels. If you pay an additional monthly fee, you get upgraded to "Unlimited P…

Mobile providers are a different beast because there’s a limit on radio spectrum. Throttling is necessary.

Re: FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

#43

Post by stewx »

snickerbockers wrote: post #35

I don't see the point of NN as long as the only "service providers" it applies to are the ones implementing layers And with NN being championed by a lot of the same services that cut off the above-mentioned it seems less like something meant to preserve the freedom of the Internet and more like something meant to keep one group of corporations in control of it.

Kiwifarms was down for like 2 days.

Side note: the Blocked and Reported podcast looked deeply into the allegations that led to that that site being initially shut down and they concluded they were bogus.

Re: FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

#44

Post by treis »

UnlockedSecrets wrote: post #10
0xy wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that remotely the same thing? The infographic above and others clearly claim that ISPs will be blocking services then requiring you to pay for them separately. Exempting services from data caps is not against net neutrality, and for example has been regular practice all across Europe (which has "net neutrality"). Isn't it just shifting the goal posts after the original claims of NN campaigners were discredited…

> Exempting services from data caps is not against net neutrality, and for example has been regular practice all across Europe (which has "net neutrality"). UPS doesn't care if it is a Nike shirt or a Gucci shirt in a box, They just deliver the box where it is meant to go. Why should it be any different for an ISP?

Seems like a bad analogy given the existence of "free" shipping vs additional charge.

Re: FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

#45

Post by zzzeek »

all good news but at this point I'd prefer if they can turn cable providers like my own Altice / Optimum into public utilities so I don't have to pay $110/month for 100 mpbs with zero alternatives, when my uncle in Wisconsin has 300 mpbs for less money.

Re: FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

#46

Post by NoraCodes »

snickerbockers wrote: post #41
JohnTHaller wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have gotten it, but with services not websites. Mobile providers will sell you an "Unlimited" data plan that throttles everything after 25GB a month. Streaming Spotify and Apple Music won't count against that soft data cap. Streaming other music services will count against it. Video streaming over YouTube, Netflix, etc is capped at 480p levels. If you pay an additional monthly fee, you get upgraded to "Unlimited P…

Is this worse than the pre-NN system where they would just throttle everything after 25GB/month with no exceptions?

It's worse for competition, yeah. If I want to start a music streaming service, I'm evaluated not on the quality of my service but the fact that I don't have a deal in place with these carriers.

If it's technically feasible not to limit the bandwidth for some services, it's technically feasible to at least reduce the throttling for everyone.

Re: FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

#47

Post by dahfizz »

UnlockedSecrets wrote: post #10
0xy wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that remotely the same thing? The infographic above and others clearly claim that ISPs will be blocking services then requiring you to pay for them separately. Exempting services from data caps is not against net neutrality, and for example has been regular practice all across Europe (which has "net neutrality"). Isn't it just shifting the goal posts after the original claims of NN campaigners were discredited…

> Exempting services from data caps is not against net neutrality, and for example has been regular practice all across Europe (which has "net neutrality"). UPS doesn't care if it is a Nike shirt or a Gucci shirt in a box, They just deliver the box where it is meant to go. Why should it be any different for an ISP?

Of course they do, its just invisible to the consumer. It is way cheaper for amazon to ship something via UPS than it is for you, because Amazon and UPS have negotiated contracts in place.

Re: FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

#48

Post by lesuorac »

snickerbockers wrote: post #41
JohnTHaller wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have gotten it, but with services not websites. Mobile providers will sell you an "Unlimited" data plan that throttles everything after 25GB a month. Streaming Spotify and Apple Music won't count against that soft data cap. Streaming other music services will count against it. Video streaming over YouTube, Netflix, etc is capped at 480p levels. If you pay an additional monthly fee, you get upgraded to "Unlimited P…

Is this worse than the pre-NN system where they would just throttle everything after 25GB/month with no exceptions?

1) Yes.

2) We're not in the NN system as it was repealed so the implicit idea in your post that the current system is from NN is false.

3) We wouldn't need NN though if we actually had anti-trust enforcement; zero-rating is a monopolistic practice. It's akin to having preferential treatment on rail lines so consumers can't get other's goods as easily.

Re: FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

#49

Post by cainxinth »

A lot of people in these comments are making the case that removing net neutrality didn’t do much harm, so why bother bringing it back. Let me make the counterclaim.

The argument against net neutrality is that it might stifle innovation. Well, we had net neutrality for many years and innovation didn’t seem all that stifled. Hence, what’s the harm in bringing it back?

Re: FCC aims to reinstate net neutrality after us Democrats gain control of panel

#50

Post by acheron »

stuckinhell wrote: post #16

Do we need net neutrality ? I didn't even know it was gone. My internet is the same as ever

It was always a con. A regulation had been in place since 2015, they repealed it in 2017, it never mattered.

Some politicians tricked people into screaming about it, and I’m sure they were able to get some fundraising because of the screaming.

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