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Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

fortune.com

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Re: Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

#91

Post by screwturner68 »

yumraj wrote: post #39
cs702 wrote: post #5

Correction: ...as demand for non-Tesla EVs plunges. Demand for Tesla EVs is... booming. Tesla sold 83% more cars in the most recent quarter than in the same quarter a year ago.[a] [a] https://digitalassets.tesla.com/tesla-contents/image/upload/...

Tesla’s been dropping price, so they too must be seeing softening demand.

They were the "cool kid" on the block but every kid grows up, becomes an adult and is no longer cool. Th same can be said about Tesla, their roadster was without a doubt a cool looking car and the fact that it was electric made it even cooler. Since then it's rode the "scrappy new start up road" busting the balls of the large auto manufacturers but Elon is getting a little long in the tooth and soft in the head, the upper income liberals don't like what's coming out of his mouth and considering the price they'd be better off purchasing their over priced EV from Mercedes or BMW. Further it's a pretty well known fact that Teslas are horrible cars, Kia quality at BMW prices. Finally like anything that's considered cool everyone wants on the band wagon, Teslas are no longer just for the monied tech mom it's open to everyone including Uber drivers, yep Uber made a deal with Tesla so instead of being edgy a Tesla is what picks you up when you go to the airport -to quote Memphis Raines, " I saw three of these parked outside the local Starbucks this morning, which tells me only one thing. There's too many self-Indulgent wieners in this city with too much bloody money! Now, if I was driving a 1967 275 GTB four-cam...". Nobody is going to drop $70K to drive the same car and Uber driver drives.

Re: Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

#92

Post by janlin1999 »

LeifCarrotson wrote: post #63
siffland wrote: post #44

Working in Tech, I love a lot about electric cars. I just have a few issues I cannot seem to overcome (this is a personal ME thing about EV's and some new gas vehicles, your mileage may vary....pun intended). All new cars spy on you (well most do), but EV's are completely software driven and seem to be more intrusive. I want a car I can connect to the internet when I want to for updates and that is it. I also want an…

> So you are telling me they could of been build with smaller batteries and save money and the environment, but they were not... If you charge and discharge a lithium ion cell from 4.2V to 2.75V, you might get 250 full cycles. If you stop charging at 4V and call that 100%, and stop discharging at 3.2V, you might get 2000 cycles before capacity is reduced. Phone and laptop manufacturers prefer to burn the battery out…

> If you charge and discharge a lithium ion cell from 4.2V to 2.75V, you might get 250 full cycles. If you stop charging at 4V and call that 100%, and stop discharging at 3.2V, you might get 2000 cycles before capacity is reduced.

Is there literally an almost 10x difference in the number of full cycles? Where can I read more about this?

Re: Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

#93

Post by lotsoweiners »

dzhiurgis wrote: post #87
siffland wrote: post #44

Working in Tech, I love a lot about electric cars. I just have a few issues I cannot seem to overcome (this is a personal ME thing about EV's and some new gas vehicles, your mileage may vary....pun intended). All new cars spy on you (well most do), but EV's are completely software driven and seem to be more intrusive. I want a car I can connect to the internet when I want to for updates and that is it. I also want an…

> I also want android auto and the apple one for my wife, I do not want a proprietary (Tesla) entertainment system. Having used Carplay recently after few months in Tesla I couldn't believe how crap it was. Can't pinch and zoom map, can't use maps on your phone while you navigate (how do I add additional stop without using screen), it wouldn't connect about 10% of drives. Overall UX is feels about a decade behind - a…

Yeah I completely agree with you and I’ve never driven any Tesla. CarPlay is an extension of your phone and somewhere between an Apple Watch and an iPhone. There are so many situations I experience where if CarPlay had like 10% functionality it would feel like a must have game changer. Instead it just feels like a pretty good maps UI (regardless of which maps platform you use) with an ok but severely limited music UI.

Re: Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

#94

Post by b112 »

Fervicus wrote: post #61
b112 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a good point. Likely, rates have mostly peaked. There will potentially be downward pressure soon. On top of that, many cars are hard to get. Low production, backlogged demand. This means fewer deals on finance and lease rates. I remember 0% lease and finance rates, 15 years ago when the interest rate was this high, because car companies wanted to move product. But now they have no need, not with them unable to…

> rates have mostly peaked What is this based on? I am not so sure if I believe that. Canada's inflation rate jumped to 4% last month (although a lot of that was apparently due to an increase in gasoline prices).

It is not 4% per month, that is the yearly rate, as a current value. And it didn't "jump", it went up a tiny bit.

Target inflation for the Bank of Canada is around 2% yearly. The bank did not increase rates the last round, and inflation is dramatically down from a year ago.

It wants to ensure it doesn't over correct.

Re: Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

#95

Post by BackBlast »

janlin1999 wrote: post #92
LeifCarrotson wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So you are telling me they could of been build with smaller batteries and save money and the environment, but they were not... If you charge and discharge a lithium ion cell from 4.2V to 2.75V, you might get 250 full cycles. If you stop charging at 4V and call that 100%, and stop discharging at 3.2V, you might get 2000 cycles before capacity is reduced. Phone and laptop manufacturers prefer to burn the battery out…

> If you charge and discharge a lithium ion cell from 4.2V to 2.75V, you might get 250 full cycles. If you stop charging at 4V and call that 100%, and stop discharging at 3.2V, you might get 2000 cycles before capacity is reduced. Is there literally an almost 10x difference in the number of full cycles? Where can I read more about this?

The top end charge voltage is particularly sensitive, this is the most chemically unstable state of the cell charge cycle.

I really wish cell phones and computers came with an adjustment to max cell voltage. Cutting even 10% capacity can double your cycle life. Some do, but it's a hodgepodge and not standard.

https://batteryuniversity.com/article/bu-808-how-to-prolong-...

Re: Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

#96

Post by Gud »

ianai wrote: post #70
LeifCarrotson wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So you are telling me they could of been build with smaller batteries and save money and the environment, but they were not... If you charge and discharge a lithium ion cell from 4.2V to 2.75V, you might get 250 full cycles. If you stop charging at 4V and call that 100%, and stop discharging at 3.2V, you might get 2000 cycles before capacity is reduced. Phone and laptop manufacturers prefer to burn the battery out…

They know people will make horrible decisions and sue.

It would be trivial to implement a battery charge log.

“At this charge level, the battery will degrade to x kWh after y cycles”.

Re: Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

#97

Post by fomine3 »

holoduke wrote: post #32
AbrahamParangi wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All’s fair in economic war, it’s not like the Chinese market is remotely open to foreign competition.

No market is open. Every country more or less handles the same principle. If there is a local threat things will get stricter for the foreigner.

China has been far close than others. WTO approve was mistake.

Re: Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

#98

Post by wlesieutre »

westmeal wrote: post #89
wlesieutre wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honda is probably not who you want to look at for EV comparisons. They have the Honda E (city car, I think being discontinued) and upcoming partnership with GM to rebadge the Blazer EV as Honda Prologue. And then there’s their “Afeela” joint venture with Sony which I’m sure will go great…

Yeahhhh Honda was only any good in the 80s-90s. Nowadays they're just resting on their laurels and abusing brand recognition.

I test drove a 2023 Civic hatchback a few months ago and thought it was pretty great. But not waiting list and $4000 markup great.

Re: Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

#99

Post by a_random_canuck »

holoduke wrote: post #32
AbrahamParangi wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All’s fair in economic war, it’s not like the Chinese market is remotely open to foreign competition.

No market is open. Every country more or less handles the same principle. If there is a local threat things will get stricter for the foreigner.

Yeah, in principle no market is open, but in the other hand the “openness” of the European vs Chinese markets is not even comparable. China’s market is notoriously difficult for foreign companies to enter and to operate in.

For starters, Europe doesn’t have the Communist Party dictatorship that can arbitrarily fuck your business over on a whim with no possibility for recourse because the Party is judge, jury and executioner.

China is a scary place to do business if you’re not a huge multinational with leverage.

Do you owe debts for a business deal/partnership gone wrong? Congrats your creditors can have you banned from leaving the country until they are paid. Oops you weren’t even notified there would be a court hearing against you, so you’re not aware of the debt until you tried to board a flight. I hope you didn’t think you had any chance to appeal that bad decision because the courts will side with the local Chinese over the foreigner.

Oh and let’s not forget the Canadian Michaels’ ordeal.

欢迎来中国.

Re: Volkswagen cuts jobs as demand for EVs plunges

#100

Post by marsokod »

Gud wrote: post #96
ianai wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They know people will make horrible decisions and sue.

It would be trivial to implement a battery charge log. “At this charge level, the battery will degrade to x kWh after y cycles”.

It's a bit more complex than that unfortunately. Depending on how long you stay at high charge level it will negatively impact the battery life. So someone charging at 100% all the time but discharging quickly might see a better cycling count that someone charging at 90% but staying there almost all the time.
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