Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones

#11

Post by pram » Thu, Sep 21, 2023, 2:47 AM UTC

“Apple had planned to have its modem chip ready to use in the new iPhone models. But tests late last year found the chip was too slow and prone to overheating. Its circuit board was so big it would take up half an iPhone, making it unusable.”

How is this even possible? I mean I get it’s hard but a 3 inch modem chip? lol

Re: Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones

#12

Post by coder543 » Thu, Sep 21, 2023, 3:05 AM UTC

lathiat wrote: post #8

brokenmachine wrote: post #2

Paywalled

Reminder: If you have Apple News (or get it bundled with Apple One), it includes access to the Wall Street Journal among many other paywalled sources. On iOS you can use the share sheet to open the URL in news and it will auto-open it. Otherwise you can search for the title. I do wish this feature was better integrated, and using the share sheet to open with any app including News seems always confusing - you're neve…

Wow, I had no idea!

Re: Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones

#13

Post by testrun » Thu, Sep 21, 2023, 3:29 AM UTC

zdyn5 wrote: post #5

What’s the fundamental reason why SOTA modems are more challenging than microprocessors for Apple? Intuitively I would’ve guessed the opposite was true.

The Apple CPU's architecture is already known (ARM). To iterate from there is probably easier than designing a modem without the basics already designed and ready to go.

Re: Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones

#14

Post by secabeen » Thu, Sep 21, 2023, 3:34 AM UTC

testrun wrote: post #13

zdyn5 wrote: post #5

What’s the fundamental reason why SOTA modems are more challenging than microprocessors for Apple? Intuitively I would’ve guessed the opposite was true.

The Apple CPU's architecture is already known (ARM). To iterate from there is probably easier than designing a modem without the basics already designed and ready to go.

Apple also has a pretty robust ability to dictate to their developers how and what they must do to run on MacOS, and they produce the compiler and toolchain as well. They seem to do a lot less shimming and other compatibility work on behalf of developers. Modem doesn't work that way, there's tons of existing, immutable hardware across the world with its own quirks and edge cases, all of which you have to support seamlessly.

Re: Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones

#15

Post by tech-historian » Thu, Sep 21, 2023, 3:40 AM UTC

zdyn5 wrote: post #5

What’s the fundamental reason why SOTA modems are more challenging than microprocessors for Apple? Intuitively I would’ve guessed the opposite was true.

From the article: "Modem chips are trickier to make than processing chips because they must work seamlessly with 5G wireless networks, as well as the 2G, 3G and 4G networks used in countries around the world, each with its own technological quirks. Apple microprocessors run software programs designed solely for its iPhones and laptops."

Also: "[Apple's modem] chips were essentially three years behind Qualcomm’s best modem chip. Using them threatened to make iPhone wireless speeds slower than its competitors."

Re: Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones

#16

Post by fergbrain » Thu, Sep 21, 2023, 3:44 AM UTC

lathiat wrote: post #8

brokenmachine wrote: post #2

Paywalled

Reminder: If you have Apple News (or get it bundled with Apple One), it includes access to the Wall Street Journal among many other paywalled sources. On iOS you can use the share sheet to open the URL in news and it will auto-open it. Otherwise you can search for the title. I do wish this feature was better integrated, and using the share sheet to open with any app including News seems always confusing - you're neve…

NB: News+ only comes with the Premier level of Apple One, not with the Individual or Family tiers.

Re: Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones

#17

Post by aurareturn » Thu, Sep 21, 2023, 3:46 AM UTC

pram wrote: post #11

“Apple had planned to have its modem chip ready to use in the new iPhone models. But tests late last year found the chip was too slow and prone to overheating. Its circuit board was so big it would take up half an iPhone, making it unusable.” How is this even possible? I mean I get it’s hard but a 3 inch modem chip? lol

Wait, they needed testing late last year to figure out the chip was physically too big to be used in an iPhone?

You're kidding right? Management didn't know until late last year?

I call BS.

Re: Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones

#18

Post by willio58 » Thu, Sep 21, 2023, 3:46 AM UTC

"Spectacular failure" is a bit hyperbolic to me. They are taking steps to move away from Qualcomm, and it seems their first real go at it resulted in a lackluster product. It's not like Apple actually shipped their phones with that lackluster chip, they decided "hey, didn't work out this go-around". I'm sure they'll get there in another year or so.

Re: Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones

#19

Post by tech-historian » Thu, Sep 21, 2023, 3:48 AM UTC

willio58 wrote: post #18

"Spectacular failure" is a bit hyperbolic to me. They are taking steps to move away from Qualcomm, and it seems their first real go at it resulted in a lackluster product. It's not like Apple actually shipped their phones with that lackluster chip, they decided "hey, didn't work out this go-around". I'm sure they'll get there in another year or so.

> I'm sure they'll get there in another year or so.

Unlikely, if you read the article.

Re: Apple’s failure to build a key part for its new iPhones

#20

Post by willio58 » Thu, Sep 21, 2023, 3:51 AM UTC

tech-historian wrote: post #19

willio58 wrote: post #18

"Spectacular failure" is a bit hyperbolic to me. They are taking steps to move away from Qualcomm, and it seems their first real go at it resulted in a lackluster product. It's not like Apple actually shipped their phones with that lackluster chip, they decided "hey, didn't work out this go-around". I'm sure they'll get there in another year or so.

> I'm sure they'll get there in another year or so. Unlikely, if you read the article.

>The company scratched plans to use it in Apple’s 2023 models, and the planned rollout was moved to 2024. Eventually, Apple executives realized the company wouldn’t meet that goal either. Apple instead opened negotiations with Qualcomm to continue supplying the modem chips. Apple’s licensing deal with Qualcomm expires in April 2025, though it can be extended for another two years.

Okay, so 2-4 years?