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I digitalized Berlin's registration form

nicolasbouliane.com

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Re: I digitalized Berlin's registration form

#301

Post by CalRobert »

fsniper wrote: post #290
CalRobert wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, when I tried to register in Tullamore years later the immigration officer fobbed me off until she tried. Thankfully the one in Athlone eventually took pity on me and let me register there.

Oh sorry to hear that. Unfortunately this is also typical Irish experience. No standards across different regions :(

Incompetence and unprofessionalism were rampant. Also: typo - I meant until she retired, leaving Offaly with no immigration officer. I had to call a TD to get sorted. Peak Ireland.

Re: I digitalized Berlin's registration form

#302

Post by carlosjobim »

rocketbop wrote: post #294
carlosjobim wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course! My comment was not about software since I'm no programmer, but about progress in the general sense. Why don't the people who are involved and take decisions within large civic projects get bored with the slow rate of progress. Like after they've stolen maybe a few millions for themselves and their friends, why not get on with it and actually start working? Is it necessary to stall progress for years and de…

There’s no real desire within the German civil service to make anything more efficient, partially because it would inevitably result in redundancies, partially because of a general malaise and sense of apathy.

Yes, but where does that malaise and apathy come from? I've certainly seen my share of it, dealing with government and large corporations, but not exclusively there.

Re: I digitalized Berlin's registration form

#303

Post by rcbdev »

vasco wrote: post #117
Goz3rr wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ran into something similar as a Dutch person trying to buy a car from Germany. The initial plan was to drive the car back from Germany, but to do this I had to get an export license plate. This can only be done in the municipality where the car was sold, and they told me I was lucky because I could get an appointment quite quick, which was a month and a half from now. I would also have to bring the car to the Straß…

To be honest though as a foreigner living in The Netherlands who doesn't speak a word of Dutch past "lekker", your bureaucracy and general services are probably one of the best in the world. Even your weird medical system is amazing when you actually need help - which I did and got top tier care, extremely fast. The Netherlands should just export their whole system to all of Europe, including the way information is d…

I doubt many foreign governments would agree that all legal matters should be documented not only in the language of that country but English as well.

While some countries provide a non-binding translation for many things, someone could set the precedent in court that the English translation if relied on by enough people is somewhat binding or similar - Result would be two slightly different (mis-)understandings about the law, due process and bureaucracy from official sources. That could be have unforseen consequences.

Just because many people happen to speak English doesn't mean everyone has to.

Re: I digitalized Berlin's registration form

#304

Post by morsch »

Bissness wrote: post #34

Bravo! Bürgerämter are most of the time a fucking joke. My registration in Berlin took months after I already moved there, the waiting times are just that long, and this seems to apply to many cities. I live in another city now, and my ID card has been expired for months now (which, legally, is a misdemeanor). There isn't a single free appointment anywhere, citywide. You can attempt to go personally there in the earl…

I can get an appointment for a new ID next week. Major city in Germany. Ymmv.

Re: I digitalized Berlin's registration form

#305

Post by morsch »

fl7305 wrote: post #98

"The Bürgeramt also wants to know that you live on the second floor on the right." Meanwhile in Sweden, the government instituted a nationwide "Dwelling Units Register", where each apartment etc is uniquely numbered. There is a precise way to number apartments based on the floor number, order of front doors on each floor etc. Do you live on a steep hill, and have to go down two floors to reach your apartment which ha…

> People leave that out, so they get asked (in German) during their appointment.

Can't say that ever happened to me.

Re: I digitalized Berlin's registration form

#306

Post by slim »

alex_suzuki wrote: post #232
tormeh wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, finally someone else with whom to fax.

Anyone here who has written a fax gateway (receive TIFF of fax, do OCR, save somewhere and convert to PDF)? raises hand (fax is alive and well in Switzerland)

hylafax?

Re: I digitalized Berlin's registration form

#307

Post by PurpleRamen »

epups wrote: post #256
PurpleRamen wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> She took that at work and proudly showed it to her boss hoping for some recognition and he said "if you wanna keep your job, don't bring stuff like this at work, we don't need it, there's nothing wrong with the way we currently do things", and then it hit me that current German software innovation culture is completely FUBAR. This seems like a very justified reaction and could happen in any sane company in the worl…

Your thinking is very common in Germany. It is correct in a primitive sense: change is costly. But it misses an additional layer of thinking, which is that not changing is even more costly sometimes. The problem was not that the company was happily using Excel and VBA, it is that the process was clunky and required expensive humans in the middle. If it could be easily automated in Python, it could also have been easi…

> Your thinking is very common in Germany.

Like the rest of the world.. I mean, we have companies like Microsoft, who basically live from staying compatible back till the beginning of time. Cooperate-world is strongly focused on stability and the ability to control your turf, everywhere.

> But it misses an additional layer of thinking, which is that not changing is even more costly sometimes.

Interesting how you completely missed the point. I was not talking about the change, but the way it happened, and the reasoning for it.

> it is that the process was clunky and required expensive humans in the middle.

Actually, we don't know that. We know nothing about the reasoning for the process, or the details, or the company.. We only know the story of a 3rd party, who stumbled over their own ignorance.

> If it could be easily automated in Python, it could also have been easily automated somehow else

Yes, unless the company has some inhouse-knowledge of using python, it should have been automated with something else, like VBA, which they already are using. And it should have been done by someone from the company, not some strange from outside. As a long-running company, it's nonsense to use technology for inhouse-task, where you have no expertise at hand. This is just harmful and an additional burden longterm.

Re: I digitalized Berlin's registration form

#308

Post by Symbiote »

xioxox wrote: post #135
Tenoke wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> German apartments don’t have apartment numbers They do (at least sometimes?). They are just not listed anywhere and barely used. I have my number in my contract, and e.g. Vatenfall have it to connect the meter number to the flat number.

They don't always. For my flat in a small block, it's "Erdgeschoss rechts" or EGR, in the contract or for the electricity.

In Denmark, abbreviations like that are the address.

  Amagergade 5, 1. th.
Means building 5, first floor, to the right (til højre).

Re: I digitalized Berlin's registration form

#309

Post by TrackerFF »

2716057 wrote: post #70

No, no, it's all wrong. Here's how we digitize our administration in Germany the proper, Germanic way: A fixed sum for digitization is allocated and the local government publicly advertises a project. A bureaucrat higher up the foodchain has a friend/cousin/former colleague who runs an IT service business side gig. Guess who will win the contract. The friend/cousin/former colleague starts building by outsourcing the…

Here's how we would do it in Norway

1. Problem is widely known. Everyone knows it sucks, and people in charge are starting to think "Maybe we should get that fixed"

2. The gov. hires McKinsey to get some strategic advice on the mater. They'll spend hundreds of thousands of NOK (1 NOK ≈ $0.093 / €0.087) , maybe even a couple of million, on the strategic consultants. They'll present the gov. with N different options, with the most obvious being number one - "Yeah fix that problem, here's our report to back that up"

3. Relevant gov. minister will order the correct department or directorate to start the project, whom in turn will take a glance at internal resources, before swiftly reaching out to Accenture, Capgemini, Sopra Steria, and similar IT-consulting firms.

4. The consultants start to work with the department/directorate, where months will be spent on gather specs, planning, project work, and all that. Regular team meetings, flying the consultants out to wherever the department/directorate is located.

5. Implementation starts, after 1-2 years. Depending on the consulting firm, a MVP is presented withing a couple of months.

6. After 2-3 year, the (still minimal) product is ready to be released to the public. Millions of NOK has been spent. The product is officially owned by some product owner in the IT department of the directorate.

7. The consulting firm will work on the project for 5 years, until the contract is either renewed, or some other consulting firm wins the new bid.

8. After 10 years or so, the product is probably completely absorbed by some larger IT-project or portal, designed to consolidate products.

In the end, tens and tens of consultants have worked on the single-page form.

Re: I digitalized Berlin's registration form

#310

Post by jupp0r »

gwright wrote: post #300
jupp0r wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are salary tiers that are the same across all government employees. A new grad software engineer with a master's degree will earn the same as a new grad biologist, even though the outside government salaries for the two might differ by a factor of 2. There is no practical way of paying somebody more than this narrow wage band even if it's impossible to fill the position with somebody competent. You end up not h…

OK, I'm not sure I would describe that phenomena as an "equality principle" though. That is just a misleading label for a misguided bureaucratic rule.

Sorry for the confusion. Not a native english speaker here (although I've been living in the US for a few years).
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