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Tonga is running out of space for more than 30k abandoned cars

abc.net.au

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Re: Tonga is running out of space for more than 30k abandoned cars

#31

Post by adgjlsfhk1 »

ttymck wrote: post #29
nikau wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems odd they don't use the same incoming ship to take cars back

Surely they don't have enough cars to return every time a shipment of new cars comes in. If that was economical, would the abandoned cars have piled up in the first place?

assuming the population isn't growing rapidly, they should. Every car imported should turn into a broken car in between 10 and 30 years so as long as the number of cars has been relatively stable you'd expect roughly 1 car in for 1 car out.

Re: Tonga is running out of space for more than 30k abandoned cars

#32

Post by lostlogin »

bagels wrote: post #10
ComputerGuru wrote: post #6

Same solution as most problems: import tax should include cost of getting rid of the car when you’re done. Then getting rid of a car is free. Ship it off the island at your expense and you get a refund.

Yes, came for the same comment. Add an import tax of 2x whatever it takes to ship a car out. Each new car that comes in, two cars go out.

This has the same issue as the proposed ‘no older than 15 years’ rule. It costs money.

It’s hard to get past how cheap it is to just dump a car and buy a 20 year old one. Externalise those costs, what could go wrong?

Re: Tonga is running out of space for more than 30k abandoned cars

#34

Post by silisili »

refactor_master wrote: post #22
nomilk wrote: post #17

I hadn't realised just how small Tonga's land area is. Imagine a square 30km x 30km. It's smaller than that (747 square km). But this table of countries ranked by population densities shows Tonga is not even close to the most densely populated countries (Tonga is about 65th of about 200 countries): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_dependen...

It’s strange how bikes haven’t caught on. Similar to Malta, which is tiny and heavily urbanized, but has a massive car problem. 30 km is what some people commute on bike daily.

Same thought. The other commenter posted the largest island is roughly 100 sq mi. This could easily be serviced with bikes, scooters/mopeds, or cheap sidecar motorbike taxis like they use in other countries.

Re: Tonga is running out of space for more than 30k abandoned cars

#35

Post by devoutsalsa »

refactor_master wrote: post #22
nomilk wrote: post #17

I hadn't realised just how small Tonga's land area is. Imagine a square 30km x 30km. It's smaller than that (747 square km). But this table of countries ranked by population densities shows Tonga is not even close to the most densely populated countries (Tonga is about 65th of about 200 countries): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_dependen...

It’s strange how bikes haven’t caught on. Similar to Malta, which is tiny and heavily urbanized, but has a massive car problem. 30 km is what some people commute on bike daily.

When I was living in America, I'd drive 300m to the grocery store because I could, so I understand the feeling. I'm also sure it's hot & humid much of the time, which makes walking & biking a sweaty affair.

Re: Tonga is running out of space for more than 30k abandoned cars

#36

Post by brutusborn »

ck2 wrote: post #5

So many of the problems we've made seem like they could be great fixed by less people instead of more each year. Imagine the next population doubling and all that cost and suffering it will bring.

Since the problem is proportional a function of population and car importation, you would need to depopulate 100% to ‘fix’ it, anything less just slows it in proportion.

It’s the same as advocating mass suicide to reduce pollution. Absurd.

Re: Tonga is running out of space for more than 30k abandoned cars

#37

Post by devoutsalsa »

olalonde wrote: post #2

Is it not economically viable to melt the cars for steel? Or is there not enough demand for steel in Tonga that the steel would need to be shipped abroad anyways?

In Bangladesh there's a huge appetite for steel because the country lacks meaningful iron deposits. That's a big reason the have a huge ship dismantling industry, and I presume some way to process the steel. But Bangladesh has a population of ~170 million, and Tonga's population is around ~110 thousand. I wonder what the minimum viable population is for supporting scrap metal recycling.

How ship-breaking helped shape the steel industry -- https://www.tbsnews.net/supplement/how-ship-breaking-helped-...

Re: Tonga is running out of space for more than 30k abandoned cars

#38

Post by sambazi »

booi wrote: post #19
bagels wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, came for the same comment. Add an import tax of 2x whatever it takes to ship a car out. Each new car that comes in, two cars go out.

Isn't this the Mount Everest trash solution as well? You have to carry out more trash than you carried in

some call it decency to leave a place just a little bit better than the way they found it, but "Mount Everest trash solution" sounds nice too

Re: Tonga is running out of space for more than 30k abandoned cars

#40

Post by eimrine »

mngnt wrote: post #20
throe37848 wrote: post #11

Maybe unpopular opinion: Sort it, burn what you can for electricity, dump rest into deep ocean.

This is actually the popular opinion, world wide. It's what we've been doing for decades. And it's terrible. The really unpopular opinion is "let's generate less trash and reuse everything we can, plus slap a recycling tax on everything".

What is the difference between recycling taxes and regular ones?
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