Live data from Hacker News

To build ships that break ice, U.S. must relearn to cut steel

wsj.com

21–30 of 190 posts

Re: To build ships that break ice, U.S. must relearn to cut steel

#21
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need mass to break ice.

> You need mass to break ice. this is one of the narrow cases where pounds comes off the bench to say, "actually, you need weight" (icebreakers slide/ride up on top of the ice and the weight of the ship breaks breaks it ice downward)

On Earth's surface, it's not like gravity is optional.

Re: To build ships that break ice, U.S. must relearn to cut steel

#22

"This new idea could reduce steel’s carbon emissions by 90%" https://www.freethink.com/energy/decarbonizing-steel Why is steel necessary for ships? From "Plant-based epoxy enables recyclable carbon fiber" (2022) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30138954 : > And once it’s completed you have an insanely strong material that makes steel look weak and brittle. It’s reported to be as much as ten times stronger than st…

A boat you could carry couldn’t break ice.

depends how hard you throw it

Re: To build ships that break ice, U.S. must relearn to cut steel

#23
post #11

[flagged]

I had a similar reaction - I thought that the ice was reducing (which it is). Wait a bit no ice, no problem.

The article speaks to that. The polar cap melting means thinner ice, which can in turn make sea lanes.

Simplistically, no ice is fine, thick ice is fine, but when there's "thin" ice you need ice breakers.

Russia doesn't have much in the way of non-polar coast (well, not the European end) so they've been breaking ice since forever. The US by comparison has very little polar coast and so less need for icebreakers.

Frankly, not sure it needs them at all except for bragging rights. Canadians maybe, but not sure about the US.

Re: To build ships that break ice, U.S. must relearn to cut steel

#25
Surprise, this is what happens when you shift everything in heavy industry or production in general off to India and China without keeping at least some production domestic or at least have everything documented and regularly (i.e. once every ten years) check if the documentation is accurate and workers can understand it to build a product that meets specifications.

Re: To build ships that break ice, U.S. must relearn to cut steel

#26
> designers, engineers and welders grapple with something the U.S. hasn’t done in decades: reliably shape hardened steel that is more than an inch thick into a curved, reinforced ship’s hull

I don't understand. Aren't modern military ships armoured anymore?

Re: To build ships that break ice, U.S. must relearn to cut steel

#27

Do we really need to OWN icebreakers? Maybe we could start a website where countries and companies who own icebreakers can operate them for the benefit of other countries and companies who want to use them. They just walk to the shore in the Canadian north, click the "Call Icebreaker" button on the app and wait for an icebreaker someone else owns to arrive.

Generally speaking, states try to avoid having critical dependencies on other states, because they become points of leverage for adversarial foreign policy. For the purposes of keeping America running, yes, we really do need to own icebreakers in the same way that we need to own powerplants, steel mills, chip foundries and and refineries.

Re: To build ships that break ice, U.S. must relearn to cut steel

#29
Two articles now I try to access the content at archive.ph and cannot make it past the Captcha. I've disabled uBlock Origin and that seems to make no difference. Is anyone else seeing this and if so, have a solution? (Firefox 117.0.1 (64-bit) on Debian Linux.)

Re: To build ships that break ice, U.S. must relearn to cut steel

#30
post #29

Two articles now I try to access the content at archive.ph and cannot make it past the Captcha. I've disabled uBlock Origin and that seems to make no difference. Is anyone else seeing this and if so, have a solution? (Firefox 117.0.1 (64-bit) on Debian Linux.)

1.1.1.1 does not work with archive.ph and the related family of archive sites, due to choices on the archive.* end of things. See ex. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36970702
Post reply on HN