Uber Pool was so cheap it increased overall city travel: For every mile of personal driving it removed, it added 2.6 miles of people who otherwise would have taken another mode of transportation.
Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse
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Re: Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse
#22One word: deadheading. Any time you share a vehicle in time but not in space (only one rider per trip) you've increased congestion due to the trip out to fetch the person. Net loss every time.
If we define deadheading as any segment on a route a transit vehicle is empty (which is at odds with the definition for deadheading from my flight attendant friends, and my friends who are fans of the greatful dead), and eliminate that, a lot of bus lines are going to become very short, especially late at night.
Deadheading at night doesn't create traffic, and if you don't do it, the rest of the network becomes worthless.
Re: Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse
#23People want to move around. This is a fundamental fact.
And once they learn how much they can move, they are unwilling to move around less (or slower). This is something all the "get rid of cars" people ignore, and it's why it will never work.
Re: Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse
#24Uber was supposed to make hailing a vehicle easier. It succeeded at that. Congestion is a matter for traffic engineers and congestion pricing.
I guess if fossil fuel companies can do it with CO2 why not Uber and congestion, sure just sign all us up to pay for the externalities.
They’re already doing that. They don’t want to pay for the parking on the robotaxis, or move them further away when not in use, so they just drive in circles taking up space and making traffic worse without even carrying anyone.
Who said having 90+ square feet of pavement to haul an average of around one person was a waste? Now we have the tech to average less than one!
(Edit: sq ft corrected, was off by 10x)
Re: Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse
#25Uber was supposed to make hailing a vehicle easier. It succeeded at that. Congestion is a matter for traffic engineers and congestion pricing.
The original ride-sharing concept that they claimed was The Thing they were doing definitely had congestion-reduction as an expected benefit, if not the main point. Whether accidentally or on purpose, they turned into a jitney cab company instead, which does not provide that benefit.
The point was to deregulate an industry to extract money from it. I say this, because that’s the conclusion they’ve arrived at, and if they were solving for any other problem they wouldn’t be here. All else is spin.
Re: Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse
#26It’s almost as if robotaxis are solving the problem in a way that they can make money off of, not trying to be an actual solution. Why would investors do that? Oh right. Robotaxis are just an attempt to do Uber without having to pay drivers. They’re not an attempt at fixing congestion. Or safety (though I’m sure they claim it). Or bad public transit. They’re aiming for the local maxima. “Fix” taxis/Uber as they exist…
Nah what you luddite. You seem more concerned about maintaining artificial jobs and stifling progress to “prevent people getting rich off of it”. Having a 100% automated driving system will fix traffic. It will be better for the environment. It will give us back more time in our day.
Re: Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse
#27The solution for too much traffic is well known and independent of robotaxis. "Road Pricing" means that vehicles pay for driving on congested roads. The price is set so that road supply and demand match, and traffic flows optimally. It also gives the road owner an income for providing important roads.
Interesting, this reads like a Land Value tax but for roads. I like it,
Re: Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse
#28It’s almost as if robotaxis are solving the problem in a way that they can make money off of, not trying to be an actual solution. Why would investors do that? Oh right. Robotaxis are just an attempt to do Uber without having to pay drivers. They’re not an attempt at fixing congestion. Or safety (though I’m sure they claim it). Or bad public transit. They’re aiming for the local maxima. “Fix” taxis/Uber as they exist…
I’d rather not ride a bus with potentially mentally unstable, smelly, or violent others, especially without at least one other human guaranteed to be present.
Re: Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse
#29The solution for too much traffic is well known and independent of robotaxis. "Road Pricing" means that vehicles pay for driving on congested roads. The price is set so that road supply and demand match, and traffic flows optimally. It also gives the road owner an income for providing important roads.
Bingo!
Singapore has solved this extremely effectively. Note that the solution is not just on demand pricing but also having good transportation infrastructure that actually is usable and is a viable alternative.
Bay Area has addressed it to some degree but I would not call it solved by any means. They have dynamic pricing which ensure you can pay to go faster during peak times. This is mostly a solution for rich people who can afford the $15-20 tolls one way on 101 but in a pinch the common person may be able to use by paying money. However the US just has no decent public transportation infrastructure that can be relied on a daily basis to live your life normally due to legalized bribery (lobbying) by the by the car companies during the earlier years.
Re: Uber was supposed to help traffic. It didn’t. Robotaxis will be even worse
#30One word: deadheading. Any time you share a vehicle in time but not in space (only one rider per trip) you've increased congestion due to the trip out to fetch the person. Net loss every time.
Wow, that’s a great point I hadn’t considered before. Thanks!
Sadly the robotaxis are already doing it. They circle around SF because it’s ‘free’ since they don’t have to pay for parking.
Taking up road space and causing traffic with no one inside because it’s cheaper to the companies even though it makes things worse for everyone else.