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MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD: A randomized, placebo-controlled phase 3 trial

nature.com

11–20 of 110 posts

Re: MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD: A randomized, placebo-controlled phase 3 trial

#11
post #9
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But also > Seven participants had a severe treatment emergent adverse event (TEAE) (MDMA-AT, n = 5 (9.4%); placebo with therapy, n = 2 (3.9%)).

Yep! I do wish they clarified what exactly that means; perhaps I just missed it in my quick read.

Sounds like what the common raver would qualify as a "bad trip".

Re: MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD: A randomized, placebo-controlled phase 3 trial

#12
post #5
post #2

> There were no deaths or serious TEAEs [treatment emergent adverse event]. These data suggest that MDMA-AT reduced PTSD symptoms and functional impairment in a diverse population with moderate to severe PTSD and was generally well tolerated.

But also > Seven participants had a severe treatment emergent adverse event (TEAE) (MDMA-AT, n = 5 (9.4%); placebo with therapy, n = 2 (3.9%)).

2 in the placebo group.

Re: MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD: A randomized, placebo-controlled phase 3 trial

#13

Even as someone who has used this recreational, I'm very sceptical about mdma for medical treatment. I have seen smart people needing professional help for a very long time after using this too often. And too often is already every second weekend, because the body needs so long to restore the serotonine. But maybe they are using very little doses? I can still not believe that taking this regularily is a good idea. Ed…

If only there were some mechanism by which we could separate people's personal vibes and anecdata from actual scientific understanding... perhaps a series of clinical trials?

History will look unkindly upon people who kept these substances out of the hands of people who need them because "I knew a guy once who did too much street MDMA and went stupid."

Honestly, adopting that position in the face of a well-designed Phase 3 RCT showing such strong results is pretty much actively evil as far as I'm concerned. People are suffering. People are blowing their brains out after combat; people are afraid to get in their cars after accidents, or walk outside or have sex after being raped, and you're like "ehh Idk I knew a guy." Come on.

Re: MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD: A randomized, placebo-controlled phase 3 trial

#14

Even as someone who has used this recreational, I'm very sceptical about mdma for medical treatment. I have seen smart people needing professional help for a very long time after using this too often. And too often is already every second weekend, because the body needs so long to restore the serotonine. But maybe they are using very little doses? I can still not believe that taking this regularily is a good idea. Ed…

If only there were some mechanism by which we could separate people's personal vibes and anecdata from actual scientific understanding... perhaps a series of clinical trials? History will look unkindly upon people who kept these substances out of the hands of people who need them because "I knew a guy once who did too much street MDMA and went stupid." Honestly, adopting that position in the face of a well-designed P…

rave massage circles?

Re: MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD: A randomized, placebo-controlled phase 3 trial

#16
I’m skeptical that a placebo control for MDMA can be valid. The effects of MDMA are pretty noticeable. The study actually asked participants if they thought they were on MDMA, and most answered correctly.

If the participants can tell, it somewhat defeats the purpose of having a placebo control group.

Re: MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD: A randomized, placebo-controlled phase 3 trial

#17

Even as someone who has used this recreational, I'm very sceptical about mdma for medical treatment. I have seen smart people needing professional help for a very long time after using this too often. And too often is already every second weekend, because the body needs so long to restore the serotonine. But maybe they are using very little doses? I can still not believe that taking this regularily is a good idea. Ed…

MDMA-AT is definitely not taking it regularly. It is done only a handful of times, with pharmaceutical-grade MDMA and no other adulterants, in controlled doses, in a controlled setting. Very different than a Tesla pill at a rave every other weekend.

Re: MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD: A randomized, placebo-controlled phase 3 trial

#18

Even as someone who has used this recreational, I'm very sceptical about mdma for medical treatment. I have seen smart people needing professional help for a very long time after using this too often. And too often is already every second weekend, because the body needs so long to restore the serotonine. But maybe they are using very little doses? I can still not believe that taking this regularily is a good idea. Ed…

> And too often is already every second weekend, because the body

The intended therapy is taken several times in a guided sessions, 3 for this study, with a therapist. They aren't just sending people home with a bottle of mdma to take before bed.

Re: MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD: A randomized, placebo-controlled phase 3 trial

#19
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep! I do wish they clarified what exactly that means; perhaps I just missed it in my quick read.

Sounds like what the common raver would qualify as a "bad trip".

I don't think MDMA is really in the business of bad trips.

Re: MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD: A randomized, placebo-controlled phase 3 trial

#20

I’m skeptical that a placebo control for MDMA can be valid. The effects of MDMA are pretty noticeable. The study actually asked participants if they thought they were on MDMA, and most answered correctly. If the participants can tell, it somewhat defeats the purpose of having a placebo control group.

Yeah this is going to be hard with all the psychoactive substances, but really we shouldn't discard placebo effect as "not real," especially for disorders that we already know are highly mediated by beliefs (about the self or the world). Reliably and persistently mutating those beliefs toward an actually improved life seems perfectly fine to me.
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