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TikTok fined €345M for breaking EU data law on children’s accounts

theguardian.com

321–330 of 373 posts

Re: TikTok fined €345M for breaking EU data law on children’s accounts

#321
post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Imagine violating some law that harms children and your fine is $2k. "Harms children". To make the analogy fair, imagine you're keeping a diary, and recording the observable information of every child that walks past your house. $2k seems like a reasonable fine.

Taking pictures of every child that walks past your house and selling access to those pictures online? $2k still seems fair to you?

In your opinion is it too high, lower or someone not understanding what it means to be in public?

Re: TikTok fined €345M for breaking EU data law on children’s accounts

#322

We're going to have state I.D to use any popular website alongside remote attestation and you guys are cheering us along the path there with cases like this

At this point, maybe we should reduce anonymization? We've had this idea since the 90s that an anonymous internet with signal amplification is a net good, but that's been turning out to be less and less true. If you want to self publish anonymously, you are not entitled to use of one of the big 5 platforms.

Maybe this causes fragmentation of large platforms, that'd also be a net good imo.

Re: TikTok fined €345M for breaking EU data law on children’s accounts

#323
post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is your frame of reference for considering 300+ million euro a drop ??

The frame of reference is a revenue of $13.2 billion dollars. What is 2.6% of your annual revenue? Does that seem like a fair fine for illegally violating the privacy of children?

Tiktock global revenue was $9.4 billion last year.

EU is like, what, a fifth of that at most?

Re: TikTok fined €345M for breaking EU data law on children’s accounts

#324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Instagram was just fined even more for the same thing. https://techcrunch.com/2022/09/05/instagram-gdpr-fine-childr...

1. How do regulators expect tech companies to verify the real age of users (without further intrusions of privacy)? 2. How do the regulators expect tech companies to verify the parents of child users? 3. Do regulators want tech companies to collect every child's birth certificate?

1. How do regulators expect Airlines to verify the real age of users (without further intrusions of privacy)?

2. How do the regulators expect Airline companies to verify the parents of child users?

3. Do regulators want airlines to collect every child's birth certificate?

See how silly this sounds when you compare to any other industry?

Oh but tech is different!

Re: TikTok fined €345M for breaking EU data law on children’s accounts

#326

We're going to have state I.D to use any popular website alongside remote attestation and you guys are cheering us along the path there with cases like this

At this point, maybe we should reduce anonymization? We've had this idea since the 90s that an anonymous internet with signal amplification is a net good, but that's been turning out to be less and less true. If you want to self publish anonymously, you are not entitled to use of one of the big 5 platforms. Maybe this causes fragmentation of large platforms, that'd also be a net good imo.

You can't really conclude that de-anonymization is good just by asserting that the status quo is bad. One has to make the positive case for de-anonymization on privately owned platforms. What are the trade-offs?

Society certainly didn't anticipate a lot of the drawbacks of anonymous presence.

Re: TikTok fined €345M for breaking EU data law on children’s accounts

#327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point, maybe we should reduce anonymization? We've had this idea since the 90s that an anonymous internet with signal amplification is a net good, but that's been turning out to be less and less true. If you want to self publish anonymously, you are not entitled to use of one of the big 5 platforms. Maybe this causes fragmentation of large platforms, that'd also be a net good imo.

You can't really conclude that de-anonymization is good just by asserting that the status quo is bad. One has to make the positive case for de-anonymization on privately owned platforms. What are the trade-offs? Society certainly didn't anticipate a lot of the drawbacks of anonymous presence.

Why do we automatically assume that anonymization is good? Where are the anonymous town squares?

Re: TikTok fined €345M for breaking EU data law on children’s accounts

#328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fines against companies should be revenue based instead of profit based. Companies have too much wiggle room from revenue to profit.

I think they should be based on guidelines that take into consideration the damage the company did, irrespective of the amount of money they make or have in the bank. That's how it works for the likes of you and me.

Not in Finland.

Re: TikTok fined €345M for breaking EU data law on children’s accounts

#329

We're going to have state I.D to use any popular website alongside remote attestation and you guys are cheering us along the path there with cases like this

At this point, maybe we should reduce anonymization? We've had this idea since the 90s that an anonymous internet with signal amplification is a net good, but that's been turning out to be less and less true. If you want to self publish anonymously, you are not entitled to use of one of the big 5 platforms. Maybe this causes fragmentation of large platforms, that'd also be a net good imo.

I guess in theory a government could strongly guarantee freedom of speech while not guaranteeing anonymity — you could say whatever you want, but you couldn't do so anonymously. I suppose until recently in history there was a limited number of methods of making public messages anonymously.

I think Internet anonymity has some benefits though: it's certainly helpful for whistleblowers revealing crimes committed by a company, government or other organization. While you could in theory still drop folders containing documents or a USB drive to different news organizations, with how widespread CCTVs are, so I think that path may become more difficult. In countries with oppressive regimes, that's even less of an option.

I'm also not sure that the lack of anonymity is a sure-fire way to improve public discourse: just look at Facebook comments (which are rarely anonymous.)

As you mention, perhaps anonymity could be allowed on the Internet, but not on the big 5 platforms — that could be a balancing act between chaos and oppression.

Though, while a policy like that might be a net good for someplace like the EU, the precedent of requiring government IDs for Facebook etc. could set a dangerous precedent for places that are less free. Not every country is a full-on liberal democracy OR an authoritarian state where Facebook etc. is outright banned — there are places in-between, where the government oppresses people but still has elections and some degree of dissent is permitted. It's in those places that I see government IDs being required to post on major platforms being a major issue. Being able to share instances of government oppression on major platforms is crucial for those places, but if the identity of those sharing it is revealed, then fewer people may speak up and share such instances.

It's a complex issue to say the least.

Re: TikTok fined €345M for breaking EU data law on children’s accounts

#330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that number is their revenue rather than their profit, which is probably closer to $3 billion. So, this fine would be (very roughly) 10% of their profits for the year.

Fines against companies should be revenue based instead of profit based. Companies have too much wiggle room from revenue to profit.

Why would you punish success? Do you not want successful companies?
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