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The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

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Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#311

Post by wheremiah »

lazide wrote: post #255
jasonfarnon wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"AFAIK there have always been addicts in every culture." Surely you would agree that there the proportion of addicts varies by culture and society, that the US for example has a much higher proportion than many poorer nations? I don't know about the first comment's claim that lack of interpersonal relationship is the root cause, but a strong social component looks obvious to me.

Cite? Every nation has an underbelly. Poorer nations, those folks tend to die pretty fast though.

There was this article about Iceland combatting teen drug abuse by providing alternative activities and social outlets:

https://www.naturalhigh.org/icelands-radical-transformation-...

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#312

Post by salawat »

dragonwriter wrote: post #187
tyingq wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's mostly right, but it's not reported to anyone. It came from the "The Combat Methamphetamine Epidemic Act of 2005" . If you want to sell pseudoephedrine, your org has to "self certify", keep a logbook purchasers have to sign, require ID, enforce the purchase limits, train employees, etc. But, the logbook doesn't go anywhere unless some investigation or audit prompts that. So, if you're a really determined cooke…

> That's mostly right, but it's not reported to anyone. IIRC, its reported to a centralized state database in (near) realtime in some states, but in any case it is definitely the case that chain pharmacies generally have their own electronic tracking and flagging to avoid getting nailed the way CVS did [0], which may be shared systems like MethCheck [1], which can also be used by independent pharmacies. So, you’ve go…

Can confirm. Snag a copy of the NCPDP Telecom spec, (pricey doc, but is basically the Bible for PBM's) for the gorey details.

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#313

Post by iopq »

orangepurple wrote: post #67
omginternets wrote: post #6

This strikes me as an example of a larger phenomenon. Take for example the counter-insurgency wars that have become normalized since 9/11. In these conflicts, there is enormous pressure to minimize casualties because these directly undermine the political will to conduct military operations. As such, the strategic objectives eventually degenerate to mere "presence", and commanders are effectively unable to pursue the…

The Dutch take this to the extreme, where the actually effective anti-cough medication dextromethorphan is completely unavailable, but complete bullshit herbal mixes which claim to help are a dime a dozen on every store shelf. I can't even imagine the amount of needless suffering people with chronic cough go through in the Netherlands.

I bought some Chinese medicine in China for the reason that pseudoephedrine is not available and it was actually too effective, dried my nose up so much I kept having nosebleeds. But of course, I prefer the actual effect of pseudoephedrine that doesn't have this side effect.

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#315

Post by [deleted] »

wrs wrote: post #210
rscho wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The effectiveness of dextrometorphan is... underwhelming in most people. But you are correct that no effective cough suppressant is available OTC in Europe.

Dextromethorphan is one of the other “scientifically proven ineffective” OTC products mentioned by the authors. Once when I had a quite severe cough I did some (highly motivated) research and my conclusion was that there is no such thing as an effective cough suppressant. At least, none that isn’t also a consciousness suppressant.

[deleted]

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#316

Post by jnwatson »

orangepurple wrote: post #67
omginternets wrote: post #6

This strikes me as an example of a larger phenomenon. Take for example the counter-insurgency wars that have become normalized since 9/11. In these conflicts, there is enormous pressure to minimize casualties because these directly undermine the political will to conduct military operations. As such, the strategic objectives eventually degenerate to mere "presence", and commanders are effectively unable to pursue the…

The Dutch take this to the extreme, where the actually effective anti-cough medication dextromethorphan is completely unavailable, but complete bullshit herbal mixes which claim to help are a dime a dozen on every store shelf. I can't even imagine the amount of needless suffering people with chronic cough go through in the Netherlands.

I have yet to figure out how Europeans treat minor ailments. Those green-crossed "pharmacies" (only open weekdays during business hours) have 4 or 5 OTC drugs and the rest of the store is just pseudoscience.

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#317

Post by fragmede »

paganel wrote: post #305
ohthehugemanate wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a source for this? > drug abuse being primarily being a function of the existence or lack of interpersonal involvement and responsibilities that would preclude spending time and money on them AFAIK there have always been addicts in every culture. Alcohol, various drugs, and strongly self destructive behaviors are not recent additions to the human experience. But I don't know any if the numbers or the rese…

Not the OP, but bring back real jobs and real way of spending your time (like real family and friends) and much of the meth problem will get solved by itself. > AFAIK there have always been addicts in every culture Alcohol addicts are a totally different thing compared to drug addicts. You can die as a result of alcohol, but there's nothing like fentanyl in the alcohol world (I'm talking about the scale of the disast…

There is in countries where alcohol is illegal, like in the Middle East. There, wet have similar problems as we have in the western world with poisoned supply - people buying liquor, but it turns out to be bleach. So I'd say bleach in your liquor is the fentanyl of the alcohol world. We don't see that in countries where alcohol is legal though, hmm.

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#318

Post by [deleted] »

buildsjets wrote: post #9

The fact that phenylepherine is ineffective is quite old and has been common knowledge for many years. What is news is that the FDA is finally acknowledging it. I've maintained my own reserve of pseudoephedrine for years. https://gizmodo.com/report-many-over-the-counter-decongestan... https://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2015/10/26/the-pop... https://www.newscientist.com/article/2089555-breaking-bad-sn...

[deleted]

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#319

Post by stephen_g »

EdwardDiego wrote: post #309
buildsjets wrote: post #9

The fact that phenylepherine is ineffective is quite old and has been common knowledge for many years. What is news is that the FDA is finally acknowledging it. I've maintained my own reserve of pseudoephedrine for years. https://gizmodo.com/report-many-over-the-counter-decongestan... https://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2015/10/26/the-pop... https://www.newscientist.com/article/2089555-breaking-bad-sn...

In NZ, pseudoephedrine products were banned, and now no-one smokes methamphetamine at all! Totally worth removing an effective medicine from the market. Haha, I am of course kidding, the meth trade is fuelling gang violence harder than ever, and it now really sucks if you get heavily congested sinuses. When I'm travelling via Australia I try to buy as much pseudoephedrine containing medicines as I think I can bring b…

You really can't get it at all? Wow! I'm in Australia, they just have an ID check and I think they just record how many times you've bought it over whatever time period in a shared database.

It works so well (and the PE version of everything is so useless), it must be really crap not to be able to get any!

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#320

Post by orangepurple »

dreamcompiler wrote: post #287
rscho wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Low dose codeine is notoriously efficient.

Indeed. Codeine was even available over the counter in the US until the mid 1960s. But of course it was also addictive, so now it's prescription-only.

Funnily enough I found codeine is available OTC in the Netherlands.
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