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Credit card debt collection

bitsaboutmoney.com

221–230 of 568 posts

Re: Credit card debt collection

#221
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US, it also means things like getting denied for jobs and apartments. Car loans will be more: You might not be able to easily buy a new car. And that's not even getting into some of the other random things. You'll need to pay upfront to replace the washer that went out instead of financing - unless that financing is through one of the rent-to-own places (which still might be cheaper than going to the pay laund…

How on earth can people be denied jobs for poor credit? You're not a creditor to your employer! Isn't this just the "social credit" system that people worry about in China, except privatised?

Someone with poor credit may be assumed more likely to commit fraud or steal from the company. Someone with poor credit might also be assumed to be personally irresponsible and lazy, and more likely to slack off, ignore necessary details or cut corners.

It isn't fair but in the US money carries moral weight, and many people assume the less of it you have, the worse of a person you are.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#222
post #80
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can count on one hand the number of times in my entire life that I've agreed to a price for a healthcare service in advance and they actually billed me the agreed upon price and no more.

Dentists tend to work that way. Now, the price they'll charge for any given service is super-arbitrary, as is what they'll claim you need. But they will quote you up-front for what they'll be charging you.

Yes, every time I can remember was a dentist.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#223
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Singapore has many systems, rules and laws that would not and could not work elsewhere. It's great that it works for them, but it doesn't work in the USA, or most other countries. I will point out that they are an affluent, monocultural, somewhat xenophobic, authoritarian and borderline fascist city-state.

There's a lot to complain about with Singapore, but _monocultural_, really?

I think they're using this to mean "doesn't have a visible ethnically different underclass". Such a thing would never be allowed to be visible in Singapore.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#224
post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a lot of poor Americans. 22% say they have absolutely no emergency savings. That’s 57 million adults who get milked by banks at every turn. In Europe, exorbitant fees paid by the poorest would end up getting paid by the welfare system. It would be more obvious that it’s a wealth transfer from the state to the banks and other corporations. So the government has a direct interest in enacting regulation that p…

Why is there no government action to prevent social assistance recipients of any sort from access to credit?

It’s not even credit, you’ll get hit with fees for just having a bank account when poor.

Wells Fargo, one of the largest national banks, charges $15 / month for a checking account (last I checked) unless you keep a balance of over $1500.

And overdraft fees are hard to avoid because the American banking system is fundamentally flawed. Companies can make charges from your account if they know the number. (This is mentioned in the debt collection article too.) If you don’t have money, your account can suddenly go negative because some company somewhere decided to pull some money from you, and then the bank charges you $50 for the overdraft.

The system is so broken, it’s hard to believe from a European point of view. The USA only got European-style bank transfers this year! Until now, almost all money transfers were being bolted onto a system meant for handling paper checks.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#225
post #36

> I will bet you that, in practice, they simply avoid collecting against anyone who demonstrates ability and financial resources to enforce their rights. This is one for the history books of borked equilibriums. We devoted substantial efforts to pro-consumer legislation to address abuse of (mostly) poor people. We gated redress behind labor that is abundantly available in the professional managerial class and scarce…

Similarly with the British system, especially the disability system. You have to fill in a 160-page form and turn up to an appointment. They interpret everything you have written on the form as evidence of ability, including turning up to the appointment itself. Ability to fill in a form and turn up to an appointment is used as evidence that you should be capable of having a job, and are therefore ineligible for help. You are denied.

You then take the case to tribunal, where it is put in front of a normal non-rigged judge who interprets the law in a reasonable manner, and are awarded your disability benefits.

This process takes about a year and is basically impossible unless you get help from someone who is "professional managerial class" enough to work the system for you.

Coda: periodically they write to you to check that e.g. the two legs you lost have not grown back. This must also be dealt with.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Who knew about YouTube?” In 2016…

The best is the slide that explains what you should do in said YouTube video: Creating Your Own YouTube Video • Any Video Will Do • PowerPoint Put to Music • Picture of Your Building • Hire a Professional Get that picture of your building in that video! That'll show 'em.

> PowerPoint Put to Music

  - Moonlight Sonata is ideal, but any other MIDI tune will do

Re: Credit card debt collection

#227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When they agreed to the service 12+ years ago, were they shown the costs? Would you say their purchase was fully informed? Hell for all we know it was an ER visit and they had absolutely no say in the matter.

> Hell for all we know it was an ER visit and they had absolutely no say in the matter This has been tried in case law, and failed. Even if you're documented unconscious, the EMTs are allowed to make a good faith assumption that you want reasonable efforts of resuscitation. Look up "implied consent" laws.

The EMTs assess your financial situation before deciding if you can afford their actions?

(Charging people for emergency treatment is one of the most insane aspects of the US system, and we need to fight it as long as possible in the UK before it gets inflicted on us)

Re: Credit card debt collection

#228
I'm in a position now where I have been on medical disability for about 5 years. I have had no difficulty keeping it. Half of it is judgment proof I believe (SSDI), and the other half (Unum private insurance) I think is not.

Because I live in Los Angeles where the only medical care I have found in the past 5 years has actually helped me improve, my cost of living and expenses have been high. Too high for my disability. I also had a brief stint of randomly having UHC cobra insurance, which basically denied every claim sent to them, which seems entirely insane.

Long story short, I have like maybe $30000 in CC debt and $50000 in medical debt that has gone unpaid at this point. I can't pay these things off and pay for food simultaneously with my standard of living in LA, and because I am severely disabled, it doesn't really seem like an option for me to compromise on my standard of living.

I think my private insurance is not judgment proof, but I am not certain. Am I just going to eventually get entirely screwed over here? Like... what actually can I do?

Re: Credit card debt collection

#229
Recycling my post from when this link was submitted 32 days ago.

_____

While I highly encourage everyone to read this in its entirely, I think it's worth a quick summary of the bits that may be personally-useful to those who don't:

* If it comes to a lawsuit in a court case, DO NOT IGNORE IT. If you don't show up, collector gets a kind of automatic win called a default judgement, and that's how you end up losing your house or having money vanish from your bank-account. If you do show up, they might instantly offer you a discount deal, often because they know their position is very shaky and they don't actually want to spend money fighting a court case that might be unwinnable against a strong opponent.

* Ask for proof. Debt collectors often lack documentation that you are legally-entitled to. ("Debt verification" under the "FDCPA".) Many never got it form the original bank, and don't want to spend time/money getting it. Asking for that proof means they may just give up and move on to a cheaper/easier person.

* Don't be fooled into paying for other people's debt. At least in the US, debts end when the original debtor dies, except in the sense of money taken away from the debtor's stuff before it reaches heirs. You can't ever "inherit negative money". Spousal stuff is more complex, but don't get fooled into paying something you don't even owe.

* Debt collectors will often make threats that are both impossible and illegal. This means you can only benefit from having everything in writing. (Or by clearly announcing that you will record a call, and then recording it.)

* The law (FDCPA) only allows debt collectors to call family members in order to get your contact information... But some of them use this as a form of harassment/coercion. There's no magic-wand for this part.

* If you agree to a vague "payment plan" and then send them the first check or bank-account info, watch out: Even if you don't write another check, they will find ways to withdraw money out of that account at the exact worst moments for you... but the best for them.

Re: Credit card debt collection

#230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hell for all we know it was an ER visit and they had absolutely no say in the matter This has been tried in case law, and failed. Even if you're documented unconscious, the EMTs are allowed to make a good faith assumption that you want reasonable efforts of resuscitation. Look up "implied consent" laws.

And what do you do when the $10k ambulance ride isn't something you can afford?

You plead poverty with the ambulance company and hope they'll settle on a reduced amount with you. They may also put you on a payment plan, or report non full on time payment to the credit bureaus. Sometimes all 3.
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