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Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

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Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#41

Post by chongli »

pxmpxm wrote: post #12
heavyset_go wrote: post #2

Looks like nothing much has changed on Microsoft's end. I posted this 2 years ago on HN[1] about how Microsoft goes out of its way to manipulate users when they search for "Firefox" on Bing using Edge: > Tangentially related, but I recently spun up a Windows VM and used Edge to search Bing for "Firefox" and this is result I got[2]. > It's a giant banner that says, "You're already browsing in Microsoft Edge. Keep usin…

They really need to fire whoever keeps ramming non-sequitur rewards stuff into the windows product. I have still don't understand what the rewards are for, despite having spent inordinate amount of time removing them from my windows machines, but it's bizarre that some product manager gets to piss a convoluted frequent flier miles scheme all over microsoft's premier product. That's akin to Ferrari covering their very…

They really need to fire whoever keeps ramming non-sequitur rewards stuff into the windows product.

How do we know this wouldn’t lead to firing the CEO? Frankly, I’m inclined to believe that enshittification [1] is the primary strategy of the company right now. They’ve had decades to build Windows market share and now they realize that growth in software license sales has all but dried up. On the other hand, they’ve seen how hard the wind is blowing in the services and adtech direction.

So they’re determined to monetize their Windows install case right up to the hilt. They know they won’t be able to sell these folks expensive software licenses anymore, so they’re selling their users to advertisers instead.

[1] https://www.wired.com/story/tiktok-platforms-cory-doctorow/

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#42

Post by 8note »

userbinator wrote: post #3

the new version still aggressively prompts you with a captive full-screen experience on start-up IMHO that is the peak of user-hostile behaviour. The urge to pull the power cord or hit the reset button when I encounter things like that is very hard to resist because of how insulting it feels, but I do wonder if most of the user population have already been beaten into submission and consider it only a minor annoyance…

The big problem is the prompt, and the options.

Most commonly browsers just open full screen as a captive experience nowadays. There's no need to force me to click buttons before getting it.

The android experience does it pretty well. If you want a second view on the screen, you work for it

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#43

Post by doubled112 »

backendanon wrote: post #36
p1necone wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ubuntu kinda sucks now too. "Sign up for an account" is part of the install flow just like Windows. Fedora is my default "easy" Linux install nowadays, the excessively corporate vibes I get from Ubuntu feel very wrong for a Linux distro.

First, there's nothing overbearing about the Ubuntu install. Second, Fedora uses rpm management, rpm repositories sooner or later corrupt themselves, happened to me and others I know on Red Hat, on Fedora and on SuSE. I'd use Debian but I've found Ubuntu's driver management to be far more stable and reliable, especially for WiFi.

Debian started shipping firmware in the main ISO this release. It mostly just works except Nvidia now, and even that's just an apt install away.

Does that make it any easier? You can download a live version and test instead of needing to find that firmware included release.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#44

Post by retrocryptid »

physicles wrote: post #21
nyanpasu64 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ubuntu is now bundling advertisements for their paid services in apt upgrade output and the GUI software sources manager, in packages which cannot be uninstalled because they're hard dependencies of the `ubuntu-desktop` metapackage. Plus they've replaced Firefox with a package which installs a Snap, which loads so slowly they added a "snap opened" notification.

This is one of the reasons why I stopped using Ubuntu and switched to pop os. Is there something keeping you from switching to another Debian derivative?

Stock Debian has been pretty decent recently. I was surprised to find it either didn't require proprietary blobs or installed them when I wasn't paying attention.

I've also been playing around with BSD and it's like hanging out with a friend from elementary school: they're a little wonky, but you remember some good times together.

PopOS isn't my favorite, but it is pretty straight-forward. If it's working for you then it's a total win. (Which is my way of saying "though I like Stock Debian and BSD, there is absolutely nothing wrong with PopOS.")

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#45

Post by p1necone »

k12sosse wrote: post #33
physicles wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is one of the reasons why I stopped using Ubuntu and switched to pop os. Is there something keeping you from switching to another Debian derivative?

Honest question, why not just Debian and use a derivative instead? I took a 20 year sabbatical on Linux in the home. But with windows 11, I decided to go back. Stopped on debian, and chose Debian when I came back. I am super impressed with how it has matured and it seems to be built in a way that really does a fair job on looking out for you as a user, and as an administrator.

The main problem with Debian is outdated software. For servers the fixed release cycle is great, everything is properly tested and it should be rock solid without really needing to touch it.

But for a regular desktop/workstation system I want more frequent software updates even if it comes at the cost of a little stability.

(Of course there's Debian unstable, but I'd rather go with a distro where the rolling release is the main product, and they maybe do a little more testing before making changes)

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#46

Post by foxylad »

userbinator wrote: post #3

the new version still aggressively prompts you with a captive full-screen experience on start-up IMHO that is the peak of user-hostile behaviour. The urge to pull the power cord or hit the reset button when I encounter things like that is very hard to resist because of how insulting it feels, but I do wonder if most of the user population have already been beaten into submission and consider it only a minor annoyance…

Doctorow's enshitification is everywhere. I use Debian so haven't experienced Windows for twenty years, but I recently travelled for three months away from the Pihole that blocks ads on my home network.

The web was practically unusable. I guess it's the boiling frog and most people have just got used to having to scroll past three pages of ads to see what they want, but suddenly experiencing "normal" ad loads literally stopped me browsing the web.

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#47

Post by dietr1ch »

dc3k wrote: post #5

Glad I switched to ReviOS and don’t have to deal with these shenanigans. https://revi.cc/

I understood more about it by reading the legal notice than the About section,

About,

> As a group of friends and tech enthusiasts from all over the world, we have dedicated ourselves to the idea of sharing insights and ideas freely among us. Our picture of the internet is that of a country without borders and we cherish cultural diversity without exception. We embrace the concept of open source, open knowledge and collaboration, sharing the belief among us that information should be free and never have a price tag. Where others hoard knowledge to gain an advantage, we share it and where people sell information, we give it away for free.

Still I know nothing.

Legal Notice,

> By downloading any of these images (ISOs), you agree to Microsoft's Terms of Service regarding (5.) Authorized Software and Activation. None of these pre-tweaked image files are pre-activated.

That's it, ReviOS must be a trimmed down Windows

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#48

Post by EMM_386 »

taftster wrote: post #8

Edge is insidious too, from a privacy stand point. There are literally dozens of settings that effectively send "tracking" data to Microsoft from Edge. All of the sync, shopping, points, url protection, etc. settings all effectively send data to Microsoft for evaluation. And they automatically sign you into your Edge profile (from your Windows profile). Ugh. I get that HTML has taken over the world and that most of O…

Edge was even automatically sending every image URL you viewed to their servers to "enhance" the images via the "Enhance images in Microsoft Edge" setting, which was on by default.

It seems like this has since been removed, but what kind of crazy decision is that?

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#49

Post by koito17 »

fortran77 wrote: post #9

Horrible! At least Apple doesn't force Safari on iOS users.

They indeed don't; they force browsers to use the WebKit engine instead. And comparing iOS to Windows is a bit unfair: one is a mobile operating system whereas another is a desktop operating system. You should compare what Windows forces on its users with what Mac OS forces on its users.

With that said, Mac OS isn't entirely innocent either, such as giving users a "Try The New Safari" notification when they run a non-Safari web browser on their machine.[1]

[1] https://lapcatsoftware.com/articles/TRYTHENEWSAFARI.html

Re: Microsoft has not stopped forcing Edge on Windows 11 users

#50

Post by l33t7332273 »

biogene wrote: post #37

I don't care for edge for the most part, but there is actually one integration with edge that I have come to like. When I click on an email link inside outlook, edge opens the link, and also displays a sidebar which displays the email. Super handy IMO. Somehow we need to find a balance that allows vendors to tightly integrate their apps but prevent abusing this. MS is everyone's favorite whipping boy, but I fear what…

Ubuntu is very usable for a desktop OS.
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