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SIM Cards Must Die

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Re: SIM Cards Must Die

#11

Post by Arubis »

LeafStorm wrote: post #5
PanMan wrote: post #4

I'm afraid if we kill SIM cards, the opposite will happen: your phone will be locked to one network, and switching networks means switching hardware (beyond just the sim). I really like that while traveling I can just buy a local sim, put it in my own phone, and use it. That would only work in these wireframes if all operators would agree to support this. Which I think they won't.

Pretty much this. In fact, it's already happening to some extent -- most Verizon phones are sold without a SIM. (At least, not a user-accessible SIM.)

That's been the case for ages because Verizon is a CDMA network, not GSM -- GSM takes SIM cards, while CDMA does not. Different tech.

This is likely to shift as V rolls out LTE, which DOES take SIM cards. So we're actually likely to see more intercompatibility as things progress. Except, of course, that everything's still likely to be carrier-locked.

Re: SIM Cards Must Die

#12

Post by [deleted] »

LeafStorm wrote: post #5
PanMan wrote: post #4

I'm afraid if we kill SIM cards, the opposite will happen: your phone will be locked to one network, and switching networks means switching hardware (beyond just the sim). I really like that while traveling I can just buy a local sim, put it in my own phone, and use it. That would only work in these wireframes if all operators would agree to support this. Which I think they won't.

Pretty much this. In fact, it's already happening to some extent -- most Verizon phones are sold without a SIM. (At least, not a user-accessible SIM.)

[deleted]

Re: SIM Cards Must Die

#13

Post by jasonlotito »

latch wrote: post #8
NLips wrote: post #3

The SIM card is so you CAN easily change your identity / phone. Without a SIM, how does the network verify your identity? A simple username and password are not as secure, and tying your identity to your phone is exactly what SIM cards were introduced to avoid.

A username and password is secure enough for things more important than this.

No.

They aren't. That they can be used as such does not make what you said true.

Re: SIM Cards Must Die

#14

Post by adeelk »

Loic wrote: post #2

I suppose you live in the US, with only a couple of huge carriers. I live in Germany, I am French, travelling a lot between France, Belgium, Netherlands, Denmark and Switzerland. I am so happy with the SIM card system. I can switch carrier if I want easily (swap the SIM card) but especially: I do not care when I travel which carrier my phone will pick. It will work, nothing to do and I know what it will cost in advan…

FYI, Birman lives in Russia.

Re: SIM Cards Must Die

#15

Post by bnegreve »

latch wrote: post #8
NLips wrote: post #3

The SIM card is so you CAN easily change your identity / phone. Without a SIM, how does the network verify your identity? A simple username and password are not as secure, and tying your identity to your phone is exactly what SIM cards were introduced to avoid.

A username and password is secure enough for things more important than this.

Hum ... like what ? It is quite critical, someone with your username/passwd would be able to call for several hours without you knowing it.

Re: SIM Cards Must Die

#16

Post by JoshTriplett »

In principle, I love this idea. In practice, without a great deal of work, this will make it much more difficult to switch between phones, which typically occurs more often than switching carriers. Right now, you can pull out a SIM and put it in a new phone, and you can immediately use the phone number with that new phone, without any interaction with the carrier.

Re: SIM Cards Must Die

#17

Post by jasonlotito »

sepposade wrote: post #9
stoolpigeon wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This I travel enough to see the benefits as well. Phones that handle multiple sim cards are also nice. I also view it as an added layer of security. My phone can't be connected to the network until the pin for my sim is entered. The ability to save data to the sim is also a nice feature. I don't really see any reason for them to go away.

Each phone could have a built in key for signing. You could tell operators to not allow any other phone except for yours (which has this key) to access your account. Not a problem.

Though, going to a store and proving who you are just to change a phone would be annoying. Maybe we could automate this. For extra security, we could use something besides a username and password. Maybe, the phone company could give us something, and we could use that to identify ourselves. Something we have. Maybe we could get the manufacturers allow us to store the identifier in the phone itself, and the phone could read the id card, and tell the phone company "Hey, this guy is good people!" that way, the entire process is all automated.

Good idea!

Re: SIM Cards Must Die

#18

Post by stoolpigeon »

sepposade wrote: post #9
stoolpigeon wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This I travel enough to see the benefits as well. Phones that handle multiple sim cards are also nice. I also view it as an added layer of security. My phone can't be connected to the network until the pin for my sim is entered. The ability to save data to the sim is also a nice feature. I don't really see any reason for them to go away.

Each phone could have a built in key for signing. You could tell operators to not allow any other phone except for yours (which has this key) to access your account. Not a problem.

What happens here - is the phone itself becomes the sim card. That is troublesome on a number of levels. I'd rather push those functions to a little piece of plastic that is easy to move between handsets.

"You could tell operators"... How and where? When I'm in Thailand on vacation, I want data but I don't want to have to worry about registering my phone - I just go to kiosk and get a sim.

When I was in Ethiopia a few weeks ago getting a sim took a bit of work. I had to give them photos and some other documentation. A lot of governments are moving this way. Once it was done though, I had the sims I needed and the phone choices were wide open.

Maybe I'm missing a piece of the puzzle but in my experience the sim is what makes me free. The idea that the existence of a sim == being locked down comes from a broken telecom system not a technical limitation of the format.

Re: SIM Cards Must Die

#19

Post by c1sc0 »

Loic wrote: post #2

I suppose you live in the US, with only a couple of huge carriers. I live in Germany, I am French, travelling a lot between France, Belgium, Netherlands, Denmark and Switzerland. I am so happy with the SIM card system. I can switch carrier if I want easily (swap the SIM card) but especially: I do not care when I travel which carrier my phone will pick. It will work, nothing to do and I know what it will cost in advan…

I don't think you love simcards, I think you love the freedom to switch & a simcard is just the way you get that freedom right now. From a UX perspective the simcard is a pretty weak solution. For a starter, why do I have to reboot my phone to switch carriers?
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