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Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

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Re: Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

#121

Post by amelius »

znpy wrote: post #82
afavour wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Modern slavery” is definitely an exaggeration but many are also not quite so free to quit. The H1B is a “dual intent” visa, meaning you can apply for permanent residency while you have it. But you must maintain your H1B the entire time, which can be a decade or more for folks from places like India. You can transfer an H1B but it’s not easy and if you quit your job you must line another one up in 60 days or say good…

As long as they’re able to switch job and can leave the states (if they want to) I don’t think that the “slavery” word applies at all. And I’m saying this because there are places like Dubai where you very often get your passport taken on arrival, can’t leave the state and can’t really go work somewhere else. There is a lot more to say, but that qualifies as “modern slavery”.

Past: a man can own a slave.

Now: the system can own a slave.

Re: Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

#122

Post by wenebego »

iepathos wrote: post #67
intelVISA wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

You don't understand what slavery is. Slaves don't get paid and it isn't voluntary. H1B are paid and is entirely voluntary. The reason foreigners accept and compete for the positions is because the pay is better than the positions they can get locally. Calling that slavery is ignorant and an insult to anyone alive or historically who has suffered actual slave labor.

If you need to work to survive, you are a wage slave

Re: Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

#123

Post by intalentive »

lp4vn wrote: post #41

Me and many other people commented here when the whole thing started that layoffs in a time of record profits and cashflows were basically a strategy to keep salaries low. At this point I honestly don't know how innocent one has to be to think that everything is an organic coincidence and not an orchestrated move. Companies colluding to make the life of workers worse and boost their profits, that has never happened b…

People of the same trade seldom meet together, even for merriment and diversion, but the conversation ends in a conspiracy against the public, or in some contrivance to raise prices. — Adam Smith

Re: Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

#124

Post by oceanplexian »

hejalajsbsb wrote: post #43
prng2021 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've personally noticed that H1B tech workers get paid significantly lower than others. It's a shameful business practice and obviously also really hurts the competitiveness of non-visa workers. My guess is that there's no clear market rate for any position. Companies can always say there's a wide range between lowest and highest paid for any given role.

It depends on the company and I would bet my life’s savings that if a discrepancy exists at Google, it is not intentional. I have many American friends, friends on TN visas, and friends on H1Bs and we are transparent about our pay (to protect each other from poor business practices). Being involved in the process there are so many legal barriers and red tape and people take it all seriously. H1B holders will get paid…

I worked at FAANG and knew more than one Indian on H1B. They weren't getting paid "the same but slightly less". They were getting like 50k TC on a team where the rest of the team was making 200+.

Re: Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

#125

Post by cj »

caoilte wrote: post #77
chii wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> H1B at big tech is modern slavery that's putting it too far - they are free to leave or quit as they wish. Unlike the true modern slavery of which is migrant workers (like described here https://www.antislavery.org/world-cup-2022-the-reality-for-m... ), where their passports are confiscated, etc. H1B is exploiting the rules for cheap labour. It does benefit the H1B holder - since they would otherwise not have signe…

H1B is a lemon market for those signing up just the same as those surrendering their passports and ending up a working prisoner. Each might luck out, but they're more likely to get exploited and regret their decision. And it gets worse every year. H1B might not meet the legal definition of modern slavery even though many are trapped just as effectively by the system but everyone in evolved with employing them is mora…

If the H1B program is really this bad, and if everyone involved is truly morally compromised, would it be better for the US to shut the H1B program down completely?

Re: Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

#126

Post by diarrhea »

maccard wrote: post #102
znpy wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as they’re able to switch job and can leave the states (if they want to) I don’t think that the “slavery” word applies at all. And I’m saying this because there are places like Dubai where you very often get your passport taken on arrival, can’t leave the state and can’t really go work somewhere else. There is a lot more to say, but that qualifies as “modern slavery”.

You're not really free to leave if you have to leave the country if you don't have a job lined up immediately.

If your passport is taken you are not free to leave. You physically cannot.

On an H1B you are free to leave whenever, and under certain circumstances forced to.

It’s a black and white difference. I don’t grasp why it’s hard to understand.

Re: Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

#127

Post by argiopetech »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #52
intelVISA wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

It's only exploitation if those workers have to live in the US. Something like 50kUSD/y is laughable to an american but is actually a ridiculous amount of money for a lot of people due to exchange rates. More than worth it so long as they can work remotely without paying US cost of living.

I know plenty of US families who gross less than 50k. They live comfortably, but not extravagantly, and not in California.

I also know a handful of people who make less than $25k/yr. They struggle more, but they still get by.

$50k/yr, $25/hr may be chump change to a big tech company engineer with a degree from a prestigious university, but it's a very normal hourly (non-overtime) wage (maybe even on the high side) for a lot of regular people.

Addition: For example, journeyman electricians average $24/hr in my state.

Re: Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

#128

Post by renewiltord »

I get it. High income antiwork congregates on blind and low income antiwork congregates on HN.

H-1B hiring has dates that matter that you're lined up to do.

Go read "Important Dates" here https://www.uscis.gov/working-in-the-united-states/temporary...

Ultimately, the Silicon Valley job market is bimodal. If you don't make $500k+ here, it's not because a H-1B worker is taking your job. It's because you're not good enough at interviewing. Because people are hiring even now.

Re: Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

#129

Post by eastbound »

fiforpg wrote: post #36
greatpostman wrote: post #13

Generally not supposed to say this out loud, but being the only American on an all H1B team at these companies can be absolutely brutal. Very alienating, always missing out on back channel communications, no sympathy for missteps

Why "not supposed" to say out loud? Sounds simply as a problem of the only X on a team of Ys. Cultural (and other) differences can be hard, it is just a fact of life. Think of it as being in the shoes of a lonely non-American in the country of Americans, if that is any consolation.

Therefore you are saying that having diversity leads to bullying and that you’re ok with that.

It’s always the goal, after all.

Re: Google, Meta, Amazon hiring low-paid H1B workers after US layoffs

#130

Post by afavour »

chii wrote: post #118
maccard wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're not really free to leave if you have to leave the country if you don't have a job lined up immediately.

> if you have to leave the country i mean, this is meant to be a jobs visa. The fact that if you quit said job, you no longer have a reason to be given to stay, seems pretty normal. You are free to leave, it doesn't mean leaving is consequence free.

> this is meant to be a jobs visa

It isn’t, it’s a dual intent visa. Job and path to permanent residency.

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