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LibreWolf – Custom version of Firefox, focused on privacy, security and freedom

librewolf.net

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Re: LibreWolf – Custom version of Firefox, focused on privacy, security and freedom

#21

Post by sneak »

robin_reala wrote: post #15
sneak wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're using this, you should be aware that the Homebrew package manager also includes the kind of nonconsensual surveillance features that this software patches out of Firefox. For this reason I switched from Homebrew to Nixpkgs.

Nonconsensual? Homebrew lets you know upfront before they send anything to their (non-US) analytics server, and running `brew analytics off` turns off analytics permanently. Sure, opt-in in preferable, but this is as good as it gets for opt-out.

It happens without obtaining consent. Notice is not consent. It's nonconsensual.

The example I provide: imagine if you put up a sign at the entrance to a party that said "by entering this party, you are going to be groped".

Telling someone you are about to violate consent is not the same as getting affirmative consent. Equating them is dishonest.

Re: LibreWolf – Custom version of Firefox, focused on privacy, security and freedom

#22

Post by beardog »

lucgommans wrote: post #18
robwert wrote: post #5

privacytests.org shows how Librewolf privacy testing scores compares to others.

Very interesting website! I submitted it[1] because it's quite the eye-opener for me (e.g. blob tracking is new to me, and if you click on the cell, it shows you PoC test code!) and I had missed its previous submission two years ago. Brave, Librewolf, Mullvad, and Tor hide the user's screen dimensions, whereas Firefox and Chrome don't. I'm curious, how often does that break things? I imagine that quite a few sites us…

>I'm curious, how often does that break things?

Pretty much never. They hide it by changing it. This results in a margin around your view port that is fitted to one of several common dimensions. Since they are common, nearly all websites look okay in it.

Re: LibreWolf – Custom version of Firefox, focused on privacy, security and freedom

#23

Post by robin_reala »

sneak wrote: post #21
robin_reala wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nonconsensual? Homebrew lets you know upfront before they send anything to their (non-US) analytics server, and running `brew analytics off` turns off analytics permanently. Sure, opt-in in preferable, but this is as good as it gets for opt-out.

It happens without obtaining consent. Notice is not consent. It's nonconsensual. The example I provide: imagine if you put up a sign at the entrance to a party that said "by entering this party, you are going to be groped". Telling someone you are about to violate consent is not the same as getting affirmative consent. Equating them is dishonest.

Well, no. To amend your example, let’s go with the sign saying “This is a gropy sort of party. Please use one of these convenient ‘I don’t want to be groped’ stickers before coming in if that’s not your thing.’”

Re: LibreWolf – Custom version of Firefox, focused on privacy, security and freedom

#25

Post by Macha »

teddyh wrote: post #7
ploum wrote: post #2

Always wondered why such projects are not part of Debian main repository.

Librewolf has been requested since 2021, but no Debian Developer has volunteered to be responsible for the package: https://bugs.debian.org/981291 > Since the Librewolf developers are providing a .deb package themselves, they could apply to become a Debian Maintainer; i.e. be able to upload that package (and no other packages) directly to Debian.

Browsers are complicated to package and so maintainers may not feel it's worth the time to package a fork of Firefox. Especially as pale moon's drama in the past may have led to a general skepticism about the whole ecosystem.

Re: LibreWolf – Custom version of Firefox, focused on privacy, security and freedom

#26

Post by itvision »

The biggest problem with all these "privacy" oriented web browsers is that you have to trust their creators explicitly and I just cannot.

Most often the developers are some random anonymous Joes without CVs or anything proving they have reputation at stake.

Thank you, but no thank you. Even if the official Firefox "leaks" something it's well controlled and well known.

What do these browsers do? I've no idea.

Re: LibreWolf – Custom version of Firefox, focused on privacy, security and freedom

#27

Post by mangecoeur »

sneak wrote: post #11
Nextgrid wrote: post #4

There are many valid counterpoints on why you shouldn't trust/use this, but the mere existence of it raises a very valid point and calls Mozilla's BS; why does this fork exist at all if Mozilla supposedly cares about your privacy, security and freedom?

Mozilla ships Firefox with telemetry (aka spyware, given that it operates silently and automatically without consent) enabled by default. They also ship closed source DRM in the browser which infringes on software freedoms. Mozilla doesn't actually care that much about privacy or freedom, it's just marketing to make line go up and to the right while Mozilla staff can keep collecting paychecks for being "the good guys…

Telemetry and spyware are not the same thing (irrespective of whatever Firefox is doing). There is a big difference between tracking to try to understand how users are using a software or getting information on bugs and crashes, and tracking with the aim of monetizing personal data.

I'm personally not crazy about telemetry implying information is uploaded to a software provider, but from experience I know that trying to create a software without getting in-use data is basically flying blind. You cannot expect users to tell you about problems or bugs they have, they will just stop using your software and you will never know why.

Re: LibreWolf – Custom version of Firefox, focused on privacy, security and freedom

#28

Post by maccard »

sneak wrote: post #11
Nextgrid wrote: post #4

There are many valid counterpoints on why you shouldn't trust/use this, but the mere existence of it raises a very valid point and calls Mozilla's BS; why does this fork exist at all if Mozilla supposedly cares about your privacy, security and freedom?

Mozilla ships Firefox with telemetry (aka spyware, given that it operates silently and automatically without consent) enabled by default. They also ship closed source DRM in the browser which infringes on software freedoms. Mozilla doesn't actually care that much about privacy or freedom, it's just marketing to make line go up and to the right while Mozilla staff can keep collecting paychecks for being "the good guys…

> Mozilla ships Firefox with telemetry (aka spyware, given that it operates silently and automatically without consent) enabled by default.

So opt out of it. Calling it spyware is inflammatory, and disregards the reality of the world that we exist in.

> It's just marketing to make line go up and to the right while Mozilla staff can keep collecting paychecks for being "the good guys". There's a lot of money involved.

And makes you sound like a conspiricy theorist.

> They also ship closed source DRM in the browser which infringes on software freedoms.

If FF didn't have media support I would switch to chrome, immediately. This is speaking as someone who has dogmatically used Firefox for 15 years. Software, such as web browsers don't exist in a perfect world that I wish it did. Instead, we have DRM, we have telemetry. A userbase requires marketing, which requires money. I wish it didn't, but it does.

Re: LibreWolf – Custom version of Firefox, focused on privacy, security and freedom

#29

Post by extr0pian »

arsome wrote: post #19
extr0pian wrote: post #10

Just yesterday I had noticed that, "Suggestions from sponsors" in the address bar had been turned back on after a recent Firefox update, and then installed Librewolf. I really want to use it as my main browser, but certain use cases such as online banking (at least with my credit union) doesn't seem to work properly, so I re-disabled "Suggestions from sponsors" in Firefox and went on with my day. Seriously, changing…

You can just disable the anti-fingerprinting features in LibreWolf and it'll work fine with online banking and stuff if you just want de-cluttered Firefox.

Thank you! I just fired up Librewolf and turned off Fingerprint Resisting and my online banking now loads my transaction history. This had been a big annoyance and why I hadn't completely switched. The recommendation I got 6 months ago was "just use Firefox for banking". Much appreciated!

Re: LibreWolf – Custom version of Firefox, focused on privacy, security and freedom

#30

Post by mangecoeur »

tiffanyh wrote: post #6

I like the idea of LibreWolf, but never understand why it isn’t just a FF profile setting (Eg “Max Privacy = on/off”)

There pretty much is

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/telemetry-clientid

Settings -> Firefox Data Collection and Use -> turn off telemetry.

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