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Paul Graham, the Commons, and How Google Stopped Being Google

theatlantic.com

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Re: Paul Graham, the Commons, and How Google Stopped Being Google

#41

Post by nsns »

zmj wrote: post #36
loganfrederick wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this debate hits at an important point; different people want different things. Some people would find it easier to type "dmv" and have the engine know they want "dmv open right now and closest to my location". Some people, like you, want the search engine to handle your input without external influences. In the end, it might be optimal for the world to have multiple, specialized search engines/apps to please…

The reality of it is slightly more meta than that. Some people just want the right answer. Some people want a tool that they can build a consistent mental model of. Hackers prefer the latter. Everyone else? That's up in the air.

As I've said before, there are searches for consumption needs, and a completely different kind of search made for research needs. No popular search engine today differentiates between the two, but Goggle is slowly moving towards a search dedicated to consumption needs, which seems logical for an advertizing company.

I might search for pizza in order to find a place to order it from. Or I might become curious, and search for pizza to learn about its origins and history. A personalized search would only answer the first option.

Re: Paul Graham, the Commons, and How Google Stopped Being Google

#43

Post by donaldc »

zmj wrote: post #36
loganfrederick wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this debate hits at an important point; different people want different things. Some people would find it easier to type "dmv" and have the engine know they want "dmv open right now and closest to my location". Some people, like you, want the search engine to handle your input without external influences. In the end, it might be optimal for the world to have multiple, specialized search engines/apps to please…

The reality of it is slightly more meta than that. Some people just want the right answer. Some people want a tool that they can build a consistent mental model of. Hackers prefer the latter. Everyone else? That's up in the air.

It's not up in the air. Everyone else just wants the right answer. Even I sometimes just want the right answer, and I love mental models..

Re: Paul Graham, the Commons, and How Google Stopped Being Google

#44

Post by yew »

nsns wrote: post #41
zmj wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reality of it is slightly more meta than that. Some people just want the right answer. Some people want a tool that they can build a consistent mental model of. Hackers prefer the latter. Everyone else? That's up in the air.

As I've said before, there are searches for consumption needs, and a completely different kind of search made for research needs. No popular search engine today differentiates between the two, but Goggle is slowly moving towards a search dedicated to consumption needs, which seems logical for an advertizing company. I might search for pizza in order to find a place to order it from. Or I might become curious, and sea…

Personalized searches also render it difficult to gauge how 'pizza' relates to other data in the public (sub)conscious. Google results used to (and still do, to a certain extent) provide a very good picture of the semantic structure of the Internet, if you knew how to read them.

Re: Paul Graham, the Commons, and How Google Stopped Being Google

#45

Post by stanleydrew »

tonfa wrote: post #24
stanleydrew wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google is not an ad company. People just like to say that because they think it's clever or surprising or something. Google does not produce ads. They sell ad space. So does Facebook. So does NBC. These are product companies selling ad space.

And without a great product, the ad space wouldn't be very valuable.

Totally agree. This is why Google cares so much about the quality of results.

Re: Paul Graham, the Commons, and How Google Stopped Being Google

#46

Post by chanderson0 »

The "personalization" of the web is not a Google-specific phenomenon. I am, at this very moment, sitting in a session at the Adobe Digital Marketing Summit where a marketer from Toyota is espousing personalizing site content to users.

This practice is being pushed _hard_ to all businesses here as a central theme of growth of the internet. In the sense that this drives better business, it certainly will be. Don't expect to go to Toyota.com and see the same experience as your neighbor anymore.

Re: Paul Graham, the Commons, and How Google Stopped Being Google

#47

Post by darklajid »

davemel37 wrote: post #27

this is really interesting. What People WANT and what they THINK they want are two different things...How people define and Perceive SEARCH and how they use search are two different things. I think Google is facing a SELF-DEFEATING reality that as they serve people with better results, they erode the perception of their brand in peoples eyes. There is clearly an incongruity between what people "THINK" they want from…

The problem with the approach Google is taking, the reason why I 'left': I felt that it became harder and harder to actually get what I want (using your caps: WANT). I know it. No, you don't know better. No, I didn't misspell that, no geolocation is a bad idea for results or - worse - language.

It's a mediocre service now. Became big with search, became worthless for searches for me. I cannot search anymore, I can play games with software that tries to second guess my intentions.

Re: Paul Graham, the Commons, and How Google Stopped Being Google

#48

Post by EventHorizon »

nextstep wrote: post #42

Does anyone know an easy way to prevent Google from tailoring my search results based off my location? I don't want to use a proxy, because then the results would just be tailored to that (false) location.

More Search Tools : Verbatim?

Re: Paul Graham, the Commons, and How Google Stopped Being Google

#50

Post by pbreit »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #25
robrenaud wrote: post #14

> It isn't that anymore, though. Searches are geospecific and social network-dependent. All of which is fine and useful, but that's not what made us love Google's search engine. What makes you love Google is Google giving you the right answer. If you live in the US, do a google search for dmv. Did it pull the one from your state? Do you really want an averaged across all searchers answer? California is probably the s…

> If you live in the US, do a google search for dmv. First of all, no, it doesn't give me the DMV for my state first. And second, why would I do that when I can easily search for "$statename dmv" and have that search universally do the right thing regardless of location? I don't want hidden inputs to my search based on my location; I want everything that determines the results encapsulated in the query.

I think you have to be pretty technical to dislike hidden inputs. But hidden inputs generally please mere mortals.
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