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An effort to ban caste discrimination in California has touched a nerve

politico.com

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Re: An effort to ban caste discrimination in California has touched a nerve

#131

Post by roflchoppa »

> she received pushback even from fellow progressive Democrats. Newsom’s office would not say whether he supports the bill.

> In mid-July, about 250 people gathered at an events center in Fremont, an East Bay suburb in Wahab’s district, for “Caste Con,” a full day of programming against the bill… Fremont Mayor Lily Mei, who lost to Wahab in last year’s race for the local state Senate seat, was given a standing ovation when she was introduced.

It’s interesting to see politics swing side based on how it’s going to affect the votes they get.

In Newsom’s case I would think he wins on larger margins and does not have to worry about things like this.

For Lily, she has no choice, due to the demographic shift in the last 15 years for Fremont, it’s been primarily richer south East Asians. If she wants her reelection she has to support the Hindus.

Re: An effort to ban caste discrimination in California has touched a nerve

#132

Post by qwytw »

whatsup7123 wrote: post #84
ramraj07 wrote: post #43

If I have to count the number of times someone senior to me or some colleague has judged me or severed ties with me because of my caste, it will be 8-10. All in the United States. If anything it’s far worse here than when I grew up in India. I’m not of the “lowest caste” as it’s perceived but by looks I am often mistaken to be a Brahmin, one of the highest ones. So my fellow Brahmins get offended when I’m not strictl…

The new law that is being passed will not solve your personal issues with socializing. The law is designed to protect you from unfair discrimination by your employer, i.e. being fired due to your caste.

Unless you oppose anti discrimination laws in general what possible reason could there be to not add caste to them? (not even a rhetorical there seem to be plenty of people who oppose this but I wasn't able to deduce their reasoning just from the article)

Re: An effort to ban caste discrimination in California has touched a nerve

#133

Post by tremon »

SauntSolaire wrote: post #52

From the article: > At one point, Sharma asked ChatGPT to define “caste,” and then pointed out the number of times that the word “Hindu” appeared in the computer’s response. “That’s not an accident,” Sharma later said in an interview. “It’s been seeded for such a long time. The word is a hate brand.” I for one am hoping this argument technique doesn't catch on. Pattern matches like a fallacy, "argument from LLM" or s…

I propose "argumentum ab automato" for this type of fallacy.

Re: An effort to ban caste discrimination in California has touched a nerve

#134

Post by [deleted] »

uptownfunk wrote: post #31

Great, good luck enforcing that. Good luck even verifying caste identity. The last name is not even close to 100% valid in determining caste identity. Also, I think whether we admit it or not, we definitely have a notion of caste in the west except it’s a combination of race and socioeconomic identity. Growing up my white friends had a whole network of friends with summer homes and we once took a tour around the USA…

[deleted]

Re: An effort to ban caste discrimination in California has touched a nerve

#136

Post by [deleted] »

vitalurk wrote: post #120
dotnet00 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Difference being that discrimination by race is already illegal and therefore banning white supremacy amounts to limiting speech. Banning white supremacy would be equivalent to banning support of caste discrimination, which is different from banning caste discrimination itself.

White supremacy is not protected speech.

[deleted]

Re: An effort to ban caste discrimination in California has touched a nerve

#137

Post by cortesoft »

whatsup7123 wrote: post #84
ramraj07 wrote: post #43

If I have to count the number of times someone senior to me or some colleague has judged me or severed ties with me because of my caste, it will be 8-10. All in the United States. If anything it’s far worse here than when I grew up in India. I’m not of the “lowest caste” as it’s perceived but by looks I am often mistaken to be a Brahmin, one of the highest ones. So my fellow Brahmins get offended when I’m not strictl…

The new law that is being passed will not solve your personal issues with socializing. The law is designed to protect you from unfair discrimination by your employer, i.e. being fired due to your caste.

Depending on the actions his coworkers took when they were “offended”, you can have a discrimination case without actually losing your job.

Re: An effort to ban caste discrimination in California has touched a nerve

#138

Post by tokai »

uptownfunk wrote: post #45

This has nothing to do with civil rights, it’s just a continuation of colonialism and the rich white man’s “divide and conquer” ideology. They have Modi, Sunak, Vivek is coming, and pretty much every executive team of every major tech company is dominated by people from the Indian subcontinent. Let’s not be fooled here folks, this is cultural oppression and warfare in a hidden form. Why else of all people is Wahab dr…

Why don't you just come out and say that you want cast discrimination to exists instead of hiding behind all that rhetoric about colonialism?

Re: An effort to ban caste discrimination in California has touched a nerve

#139

Post by throw_pm23 »

grayhatter wrote: post #13

As someone completely ignorant in this cultural phenomenon, given it seems to be hurting some people what are the arguments for not banning it as discrimination? (I was hoping to read at least one in the article, but perhaps I'm blind?)

As an outsider: perhaps there is some harm in producing laws for every specific situation and there should be some generic non-discrimination rule that should also cover this case.

For example, I would find it silly if there were specific laws against stealing bread, stealing a doughnut, stealing a flower, etc.

Re: An effort to ban caste discrimination in California has touched a nerve

#140

Post by flangola7 »

edgarvaldes wrote: post #44

As an outsider: Is there going to be people that now will openly admit they are low caste in an effort to be a protected class? That's the only reason I see as to why some people are against the proposal: people will start talking more and more about caste in a country and a culture where this does not exist.

Unfortunately it does exist here, in Indian subculture. Workers are absolutely discriminated against by Indians of other castes.
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