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How South Korea’s birth rate dropped below Japan’s

nippon.com

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Re: How South Korea’s birth rate dropped below Japan’s

#231

Post by wing-_-nuts »

neom wrote: post #202

My wife and I have opted not to have children for reasons* and it's really sad how the conversation with the in-laws has moved from "you should have children because children" to "you need to have children because korea needs you to have children", and it's not just a passing comment here and there, the campaign to get us to single handedly re-populate SK is intense and sustained. I wonder if other couples are experi…

I'm not arguing your decision to not have children. I've made the same decision myself, but the 'can't afford to have children' has always confused me.

Even after the point where contraception became readily available, people were having children with far fewer resources than anyone alive today. What I hear when people say 'We can't afford to have children' is an additional '...and maintain our current standard of living'.

It seems there's a lot of expectations that we heap on parents. My kids must have their own room. Must go to a prestigous private school. Must participate in expensive sports. Must travel. Must attend a top university, on and on.

Kids don't have to have any of that (ok, own room is pretty important after a certain age). The truth is parents need to chill out of this evolutionary arms race to make sure little timmy has every possible advantage even if they run themselves ragged getting there.

Re: How South Korea’s birth rate dropped below Japan’s

#232

Post by bachmeier »

1-6 wrote: post #211
1-6 wrote: post #199

South Korea is hostile for new families. Unless you were born to rich parents, have a decent education with a good job (that's with a Multi-national or a Chaebol), own property in Seoul, find a partner, and survive the probability of divorce, having a child is impossible--let alone having two to meet the population replacement rate. What's the solution?

One issue is that there are many who are not willing to live normal lives and there's this constant battle of trying to outdo one another. People are trying to please even mere strangers standing next to them at the crosswalk. Living mediocre is bad and there's a negative stigma associated to being middle to lower class. If your apartment isn't a Prugio or Lotte Castle and live in Bangbae; If your car isn't a AMG, BM…

> My solution? Spread the population apart such that people will stop comparing themselves with one another.

That would fix the problem, but it's not a solution, because there's no practical way to implement it. It's hard to imagine that even five people would willingly move out of Seoul.

Re: How South Korea’s birth rate dropped below Japan’s

#233

Post by wholien »

Daishiman wrote: post #220
Hitton wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't worry to much about climate change, humanity overcame bigger problems. And if your in-laws want children so much, just tell them your concerns, they might be willing to chip in financially.

I think you are seriously underestimating the impacts that worldwide crop failures in the next 20 years are going to have as far as global human catastrophes go.

What percentage of crops will fail in 20 years?

Re: How South Korea’s birth rate dropped below Japan’s

#234

Post by carlosjobim »

neom wrote: post #202

My wife and I have opted not to have children for reasons* and it's really sad how the conversation with the in-laws has moved from "you should have children because children" to "you need to have children because korea needs you to have children", and it's not just a passing comment here and there, the campaign to get us to single handedly re-populate SK is intense and sustained. I wonder if other couples are experi…

You write that you have "opted" and then that you can't afford having children. That sounds more like childlessness was forced upon you - unless you've explicitly decided to be poor (such as for example monks do).

Many cultures value independence, so when people are forced to things, they tend to twist it around by saying it was their decision. That's why important issues get swept under the rug.

Re: How South Korea’s birth rate dropped below Japan’s

#236

Post by gottorf »

sapa777 wrote: post #215
gottorf wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To add some color: South Korea is somewhere between the size of Kentucky and Indiana (the 37th and 38th largest states), yet has over 51 million people, almost 15 million more than California, the most populous state. It has very few natural resources to speak of, and is roughly two-thirds mountainous, meaning most of the population is condensed in the few flat areas. In some ways, it's natural that the fertility rat…

As impressive as it sounds to say South Korea developed successfully on its own, did it? Did the US play any hand in its development? I mean obviously South Korea would not exist had it not been for the US' help in the war. But even afterwards, is there an sort of advantage South Korea had by having the US (the leading super power at the time) help?

I didn't mean to imply that South Korea developed all on its own. (A good example of a country that tried to do that, with closed borders, is its northern neighbor.) Certainly, having the foremost superpower in its corner helped tremendously, much like the Marshall Plan did for post-WW2 Western Europe. It's a fascinating history that I can in no way do justice in a HN comment, save to say that one can't simply throw money at a country and come out with a result like South Korea. :-)

Re: How South Korea’s birth rate dropped below Japan’s

#237

Post by ericmcer »

neom wrote: post #202

My wife and I have opted not to have children for reasons* and it's really sad how the conversation with the in-laws has moved from "you should have children because children" to "you need to have children because korea needs you to have children", and it's not just a passing comment here and there, the campaign to get us to single handedly re-populate SK is intense and sustained. I wonder if other couples are experi…

I dunno about SK but in the USA the road to kids was: partner up, get a stable income, find a home, start a family. The second and third links in that chain are broken for most people. The older generation wants to work into their 70s and own a bunch of rental properties so… no grandkids.

Re: How South Korea’s birth rate dropped below Japan’s

#239

Post by spaniard89277 »

neom wrote: post #202

My wife and I have opted not to have children for reasons* and it's really sad how the conversation with the in-laws has moved from "you should have children because children" to "you need to have children because korea needs you to have children", and it's not just a passing comment here and there, the campaign to get us to single handedly re-populate SK is intense and sustained. I wonder if other couples are experi…

In Spain there's no institutional pressure, but peer pressure. I'm expected to have children and pay +1/2 of my income in rent, have little savings, etc.

I'm pretty much an average spaniard in financial terms.

Climate change frightens me too.

I mean, If I had children I would have fear for their future and I would be completely ruined financially.

But it seems this is completely incomprehensible to older generations that wonder why youngster complain about getting hands in their pocket trough rent, pensions, debt, etc.

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