Earlier quoted context omitted.
Race is an ambiguous delineation of a tribe someone might belong to. Sex, age, etc are more defined delineations. Who is to say the 1.3B population of Indians does not have multiple races? They might all be the same tribe in the eyes of a person with ancestors from Europe, born and raised in the US. But for someone in India, they very well could view the other 1.29B Indians as being in tribes as different as “white”…
Race in the US is not a “socioeconomic tribe”. You said it yourself, it’s based on physical features. That’s not what a caste is.
My Caste
421–430 of 451 posts
Re: My Caste
#422Earlier quoted context omitted.
No one wants to talk about the giant elephant in the room: reservation system vs. competence. Go to any govt office: the chief of some division is incompetent, some low-level clerk does the heavy lifting. Of course, this low-level clerk happens to be from non-reserved category, as both recruitment and promotions in the government are driven by reservations. Why people (both reserved and non-reserved) send their kids…
IITs? I have been hearing talks of forcing it on ISRO and private companies.
[1] https://www.isro.gov.in/media_isro/pdf/recruitmentNotice/202...
Re: My Caste
#423Earlier quoted context omitted.
Bal Thackeray is no way a Maratha, although he fought for Marathi and Hindu identity. Just shows how complex things are. Also the PM is OBC for what I know off.
Bal Thackery's family are Chandraseniya Kayastha Prabhu. Isn't that Maratha caste as well?
Re: My Caste
#424EDIT: s/cast/caste/
Re: My Caste
#425I am late to the party but people here need to understand this whole issue from a factual data-based viewpoint rather than from biased anecdotal articles. For Western audiences the article they should read is Social Realities of Indian Americans: Results From the 2020 Indian American Attitudes Survey by Carnegie Endowment - https://carnegieendowment.org/2021/06/09/social-realities-of... The above is the third in a 3-…
Re: My Caste
#426Earlier quoted context omitted.
Equality is the prerogative of the government. Why do you want equal share in someone's private property? This is what reservations in the private sector mean. Someone takes all the risk, and works their ass off to establish a business and you come in with demands of equality in what someone else has made.
I want discrmination, of any shape, form and kond and for all reasons, to go away in the private sector as well. Your, and my, personal freedom stop where someone elses begins. And that explicitly includes caste based discrimination, among all other forms.
Basically arbitrary rule. Someone else's personal freedom can begin anywhere according to this statement. It can even begin in your home, doesn't matter whether you live alone or not.
Re: My Caste
#427I belong to one of the Poor states of India, one of the bimaru states.
We are not eligible for
Healthcare by government
But we pay 4/5th of our incomes as taxes.
My parents do not get any help, pension, from the government I have to use all my leftover income to pay for healthcare of my parents
My children will be having to work 3/4th harder than anyone else for the same colleges seat, and will pay at least 7 times more fee for the same college seat.
We never had any generational wealth, no farm lands.
The politician have been Gaslighting us since decades that somehow we are the culprits, just for been born.
The politicians have been ignoring, trolling, downplaying our concerns since decades in these 4 states.
The politicians only want 70% of our income as taxes and we have to watch our parents die because we don't have money.
We have to watch our children get injured on roads and use cheaper medicine because we don't have money leftover after paying taxes.
Do not let anyone Gaslight, do not let anyone convince that you are the culprits just for being born.
Just because something exists on the internet doesn't mean it's correct.
Do not believe anything written on the internet unless it is vetted by all sided
From the last 4 decades, 10% of the population has been deprived of 50% of the government jobs.
Not all of That 10% doesn't may not have generational wealth.
Do not let anyone convince you that that person is oppressed.
Ask about the generational wealth, ask about the real estate owned by the family.
A person who pays 7times fee for the same college will not own a house as compared to a person who pays 0 few for the same college.
Do not let anyone convince you whose parents are government job holders that he/she is oppressed.
The only oppressed people in India are those who pay their taxes and get nothing on return, have to watch their mothers die, have to watch their children heartbroken for scoring extremely good marks and still be denied admission.
Re: My Caste
#428Earlier quoted context omitted.
What if differences in outcome are due to genetics? Do we then genetically engineer each group (this tech will soon be widespread) until all group outcomes are equalized? Serious question btw, I have heard someone applauding this (and seeing it as likely to occur as an emergent phenomenon due to free market competition). (As a humorous side-note: I heard someone say in an interview, "I hope that differences in intell…
I mean the vast majority of studies indicate environmental factors like access to healthy food, a strong family, educational opportunities, and the literal environment are what drives difference in outcomes, not "genetic inferiority". Maybe someone from a lower (poorer) caste was raised on a diet of food grown in polluted/ tainted fields, grew up with poor air quality, and their water comes through lead pipes or othe…
My argument was not "we should strive for equality of outcome, even if it means eugenics!" but rather to point out that it is an absurd goal.
As for my amusement, it was at this person (I can't remember the name) expressing a hope that outcomes are due to genetics, because he saw this as the optimal situation (due to the inevitable progress of technology), rather than hopeless as most people do.
Also just to be perfectly clear, I am not rejecting the role of environment. I am just also not rejecting the role of genetics. If genetics really didn't matter, differences in outcome between me and a banana would be purely environmental.
Re: My Caste
#429first and foremost, discrimination in India still exists in some form to this day. however, it is not dominated or restricted by which family tree you are born into. as more people have (socio-economic and otherwise) mobility than ever, living in another region can sometimes feel like being an alien in your own country. despite that, i am proud of how far we've come along and (mostly) kept it together.
i am not sure if we have a golden standard about correcting historical mistakes as a society. but what we are doing about this in practice does not seem like much either.
among almost every aspirant starting their careers, you will hear about "reservation". while corporations elsewhere might have it as ensuring participation of all genders in their executive boards, it goes much deeper in India.
what i disagree with it is the "equal opportunity" bit. instead of focusing on increasing accessibility to a better life for all, politically it has been weaponized to rather gatekeep who gets a better shot at what is there. although very different circumstances, it rings home to how it has been with the recent representation movement (hoping it does not step on too many nerves).
after many generations under this approach, there is now a new reason for resentment between different parts of society.
Re: My Caste
#430I am late to the party but people here need to understand this whole issue from a factual data-based viewpoint rather than from biased anecdotal articles. For Western audiences the article they should read is Social Realities of Indian Americans: Results From the 2020 Indian American Attitudes Survey by Carnegie Endowment - https://carnegieendowment.org/2021/06/09/social-realities-of... The above is the third in a 3-…
factual data is an interesting term, I think this whole discussion is about how factual data at present fail to consider lack of opportunities some people faced historically. We must understand differences between Reporting and Journalism.
No; see my other comment here - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37333669
Westerners have no clue when it comes to the huge diversity existing in India on Social/Religious/Linguistic/Economic/Caste/Nutrition etc. parameters and how each is being "gamed" by vested interests both in India and abroad to suit their agendas. Hence "Equal Opportunities" does not guarantee "Equal Outcomes". The wikipedia page "Reservations in India" linked to in my above comment gives the details and finer points which i highly recommend reading in entirety to understand the complexities involved.