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Reaching the Unix philosophy's logical extreme with WebAssembly

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Re: Reaching the Unix philosophy's logical extreme with WebAssembly

#52

Post by csjh »

bykhun wrote: post #30

I wonder if we can reliably expect React-in-Rust framework that compiles to wasm instead of js? Or maybe just a React library written in Rust, but you can still write the source code in javascript? Or maybe at least Typescript-to-WASM compiler to skip JS output?

I doubt the gains from React rewritten in Rust would be significant; the expensive code is the stuff you write in components

Also Typescript -> WASM exists in some form through assemblyscript

Re: Reaching the Unix philosophy's logical extreme with WebAssembly

#54

Post by mr_toad »

patmorgan23 wrote: post #37
capableweb wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean probably, yeah, but why? You'd still need JS to involve the DOM with anything, and that's the performance expensive stuff, so might as well just do the whole thing in JS.

Isn't there work on letting WASM call the DOM/Browser API's directly without having to go through JavaScript?

Like nuclear fusion, it’s always just over the horizon.

Re: Reaching the Unix philosophy's logical extreme with WebAssembly

#55

Post by Cloudef »

ilaksh wrote: post #4

Wasn't there some kind of components proposal that would let modules written in different languages running in web assembly interop with each other? WASI is great but there was an opportunity to standardize on something much more powerful. Anyway I think the logical extreme of Unix philosophy started with Unix, moved on to Plan 9, and continued to improve from there. It's just that those further advancements are less…

Not sure if we continued to improve from plan9, it's more like features were copied from plan9 but due to the fundamental differences in the foundation they aren't really the same and requires boilerplate to be actually usable.

Re: Reaching the Unix philosophy's logical extreme with WebAssembly

#56

Post by fallat »

Neat talk but like... doesn't it all seem convoluted? What is the function of a Rube Goldberg web service? To allow it be made of anything?

The problem with using Rust in Go is that you entirely miss all the parts you don't use Rust; you get the VM overhead of WASM so it kills Rust perf; you most likely introduce problems at the boundaries of Rust/Go.

Again it's a neat idea but why in all things sane would anyone intentionally do this outside of puzzle-solving satisfaction?

Re: Reaching the Unix philosophy's logical extreme with WebAssembly

#57

Post by nine_k »

fallat wrote: post #56

Neat talk but like... doesn't it all seem convoluted? What is the function of a Rube Goldberg web service? To allow it be made of anything? The problem with using Rust in Go is that you entirely miss all the parts you don't use Rust; you get the VM overhead of WASM so it kills Rust perf; you most likely introduce problems at the boundaries of Rust/Go. Again it's a neat idea but why in all things sane would anyone int…

This looks more than a bit like the Inferno OS, created by some of the same folks who created Unix.

WASM allows to distribute cross-platform binary code written in memory-safe Rust, running on pretty compact VM. Think about a plugin architecture that could be built on top of that.

Re: Reaching the Unix philosophy's logical extreme with WebAssembly

#58

Post by fyrn_ »

alphazard wrote: post #50

The pipeline pattern has its uses, but it's not the most important (or even the most well known?) tenant of the Unix philosophy. It's "Everything is a File"[0]. That one has really stood the test of time. And it's often misunderstood to mean that everything implements {Read,Write,Seek,Truncate, etc.}. Then when a TCP socket or character device or whatever shows up, the whole abstraction leaks, and it seems like not e…

They talk pretty extensively about everything is a file? They even mention the "everything is a file" description of that concept

Re: Reaching the Unix philosophy's logical extreme with WebAssembly

#59

Post by some_furry »

fallat wrote: post #56

Neat talk but like... doesn't it all seem convoluted? What is the function of a Rube Goldberg web service? To allow it be made of anything? The problem with using Rust in Go is that you entirely miss all the parts you don't use Rust; you get the VM overhead of WASM so it kills Rust perf; you most likely introduce problems at the boundaries of Rust/Go. Again it's a neat idea but why in all things sane would anyone int…

> Neat talk but like... doesn't it all seem convoluted? What is the function of a Rube Goldberg web service? To allow it be made of anything?

I don't want to be the guy who explains the joke, but sometimes Xe creates elaborate shitposts that aren't entirely shitposts but contain a very fun element to them rather than being for fully practical sake. Shitposting being an anagram for top insights after all.

That's the lens I used when interpretating this talk.

Re: Reaching the Unix philosophy's logical extreme with WebAssembly

#60

Post by colordrops »

fyrn_ wrote: post #58
alphazard wrote: post #50

The pipeline pattern has its uses, but it's not the most important (or even the most well known?) tenant of the Unix philosophy. It's "Everything is a File"[0]. That one has really stood the test of time. And it's often misunderstood to mean that everything implements {Read,Write,Seek,Truncate, etc.}. Then when a TCP socket or character device or whatever shows up, the whole abstraction leaks, and it seems like not e…

They talk pretty extensively about everything is a file? They even mention the "everything is a file" description of that concept

Yeah seems the GP didn't watch the video.
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