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Declining fertility ideals? Young people more often prefer having no children

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Re: Declining fertility ideals? Young people more often prefer having no children

#11

Post by oldoracle »

barrysteve wrote: post #9

There was a significant dip in birthrates during the 1920s. Twenty years later something terrible happened to a lot of sons. It is plausible to me, some people lose the will to have kids, when it is most disadvantageous to have children. Something is off, we can all sense it.

That sense is just prior experience, from conversation, news story, etc building memory over time.

“Inequality is growing” headlines have been in the news since the 90s.

What you prescribe to ethereal magic is years of shared prior experience and exposure.

Re: Declining fertility ideals? Young people more often prefer having no children

#12

Post by fastneutron »

ddejohn wrote: post #10

I would have loved to have kids. I'm 33 and will never have children. I consider it morally irresponsible to bring children into a world where they will have to deal with the worst of the changing climate. That's it, that's the only reason. It's heartbreaking, and yes, cynical -- but it's not a risk I'm willing to take ("the world will turn itself around and band together to mitigate climate change" is not a gamble I…

If you’re in a developed nation, and unless you expect the earth to go through an irreversible Venus syndrome in the next century, I don’t see how this argument is anything more than a fig leaf for more fundamental social ailments. What would you say to someone in 700 AD, for whom the next 1000 years were more likely to be objectively worse in terms of quality of life than the next 1000, even accounting for what climate change is expected, intervention notwithstanding.

The costs of childcare, housing and education have exploded, and even establishing the relationship needed to do the deed in the first place is arguably harder than it s been. That sucks and there’s little any individual can do about it, despite the rhetoric blaming it on the generations most likely to be impacted by it. Climate is a convenient scapegoat to deflect blame, but we were never to blame in the first place.

Re: Declining fertility ideals? Young people more often prefer having no children

#13

Post by recontraputo »

ddejohn wrote: post #10

I would have loved to have kids. I'm 33 and will never have children. I consider it morally irresponsible to bring children into a world where they will have to deal with the worst of the changing climate. That's it, that's the only reason. It's heartbreaking, and yes, cynical -- but it's not a risk I'm willing to take ("the world will turn itself around and band together to mitigate climate change" is not a gamble I…

[flagged]

Re: Declining fertility ideals? Young people more often prefer having no children

#14

Post by [deleted] »

ddejohn wrote: post #10

I would have loved to have kids. I'm 33 and will never have children. I consider it morally irresponsible to bring children into a world where they will have to deal with the worst of the changing climate. That's it, that's the only reason. It's heartbreaking, and yes, cynical -- but it's not a risk I'm willing to take ("the world will turn itself around and band together to mitigate climate change" is not a gamble I…

[deleted]

Re: Declining fertility ideals? Young people more often prefer having no children

#15

Post by themacguffinman »

fastneutron wrote: post #12
ddejohn wrote: post #10

I would have loved to have kids. I'm 33 and will never have children. I consider it morally irresponsible to bring children into a world where they will have to deal with the worst of the changing climate. That's it, that's the only reason. It's heartbreaking, and yes, cynical -- but it's not a risk I'm willing to take ("the world will turn itself around and band together to mitigate climate change" is not a gamble I…

If you’re in a developed nation, and unless you expect the earth to go through an irreversible Venus syndrome in the next century, I don’t see how this argument is anything more than a fig leaf for more fundamental social ailments. What would you say to someone in 700 AD, for whom the next 1000 years were more likely to be objectively worse in terms of quality of life than the next 1000, even accounting for what clim…

> What would you say to someone in 700 AD, for whom the next 1000 years were more likely to be objectively worse in terms of quality of life than the next 1000

Not OP, but I would probably say something like "don't have kids, it's morally irresponsible to bring children into a world where they will have to deal with conditions likely worse and far more barbaric than climate change which causes immense suffering in the future".

Then I'd quickly duck out before they reported me for being a witch.

Re: Declining fertility ideals? Young people more often prefer having no children

#17

Post by mrDmrTmrJ »

ddejohn wrote: post #10

I would have loved to have kids. I'm 33 and will never have children. I consider it morally irresponsible to bring children into a world where they will have to deal with the worst of the changing climate. That's it, that's the only reason. It's heartbreaking, and yes, cynical -- but it's not a risk I'm willing to take ("the world will turn itself around and band together to mitigate climate change" is not a gamble I…

Respectfully, and this is a very personal decision, I see it the opposite way that you do.

Our ability to counteract, or reverse, climate change will be directly related to the vitality and economic power of future civilization. So if you have lots of children, in a thriving society, then humanity will be more able to reverse climate change than it is today.

As data, consider that US emissions have already peaked. And "The proposed wind, solar and battery projects seeking interconnection to U.S. transmission grids today are enough to bring the country to 80 percent carbon-free electricity by 2030."[1]

Certainly we are a long, long way from making total global emissions negative. But we can give our children the tools they need to completely reverse climate change. And if there're in a healthy and thriving society they're likely to solve the problem that we have caused.

The slope of US emissions is already in the right direction - I can't wait for the total amount to go negative!

https://www.canarymedia.com/articles/transmission/the-us-has...

Re: Declining fertility ideals? Young people more often prefer having no children

#18

Post by BearfootCoder »

barrysteve wrote: post #9

There was a significant dip in birthrates during the 1920s. Twenty years later something terrible happened to a lot of sons. It is plausible to me, some people lose the will to have kids, when it is most disadvantageous to have children. Something is off, we can all sense it.

There was a significant drop in birthrates in the 1920s because millions of the men who would have fathered those children were dead.

Re: Declining fertility ideals? Young people more often prefer having no children

#19

Post by Frannyies »

mrDmrTmrJ wrote: post #17
ddejohn wrote: post #10

I would have loved to have kids. I'm 33 and will never have children. I consider it morally irresponsible to bring children into a world where they will have to deal with the worst of the changing climate. That's it, that's the only reason. It's heartbreaking, and yes, cynical -- but it's not a risk I'm willing to take ("the world will turn itself around and band together to mitigate climate change" is not a gamble I…

Respectfully, and this is a very personal decision, I see it the opposite way that you do. Our ability to counteract, or reverse, climate change will be directly related to the vitality and economic power of future civilization. So if you have lots of children, in a thriving society, then humanity will be more able to reverse climate change than it is today. As data, consider that US emissions have already peaked. An…

We are not in a position were we have not enough people to solve any specific problem.

I don't get your logic.

Re: Declining fertility ideals? Young people more often prefer having no children

#20

Post by prennert »

mrDmrTmrJ wrote: post #17
ddejohn wrote: post #10

I would have loved to have kids. I'm 33 and will never have children. I consider it morally irresponsible to bring children into a world where they will have to deal with the worst of the changing climate. That's it, that's the only reason. It's heartbreaking, and yes, cynical -- but it's not a risk I'm willing to take ("the world will turn itself around and band together to mitigate climate change" is not a gamble I…

Respectfully, and this is a very personal decision, I see it the opposite way that you do. Our ability to counteract, or reverse, climate change will be directly related to the vitality and economic power of future civilization. So if you have lots of children, in a thriving society, then humanity will be more able to reverse climate change than it is today. As data, consider that US emissions have already peaked. An…

How can emissions be indirectly correlated with the population size on earth?
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