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Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

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Re: Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

#21

I expect a major pilot shortage in recent years. Not too long ago many of them were on strike [1] [2], due to apparently bad pay and high burnout. It really is a thankless profession. [1] https://www.cnbc.com/2023/06/29/southwest-pilots-union-lays-... [2] https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/united-ai...

Government will solve this by opening up H1B visas to pilots.

Re: Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

#22

I wouldn't call it harassment. It's clear it's just easier to catch the vets because they also lied to the VA. I admit they VA has it short comings. But there more vets in need then there are not,embellishing your condition to get more benefits is dishonorable. What's not surprising is pilots who lie about their health to keep making money. Especially in this economy.

Dishonorable? Lying us into wars is dishonorable. Stop putting government bureaucrats in charge of so much money, its obvious they can't spend it appropriately, I could get a hell of a lot more bang for my buck out of spending my own money.

I'm very personally against the war state and general US imperialism but I don't think the "bang for your buck" argument is necessarily true. I couldn't personally secure alliances with or occupations of oil rich nations that allow for me to have access to extremely cheap energy. I think I benefit from it, but that doesn't make it just

Re: Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

#23
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am well aware of Agent Orange and am also aware that anyone that was anywhere close to Agent Orange figures out a way to correlate every single health issue they experience to Agent Orange. I'm not saying that Agent Orange wasn't a problem and, of course, it caused health issues for many people. What I am saying is that a 80 year old man, that is 100 pounds overweight, who develops diabetes didn't necessarily get d…

Yes, that is exactly the same logic the VA uses to deny claims to people who did in fact get diabetes from Agent Orange exposure. Looks like you have a bright future in claims adjustment! ;-) Edit: There's plenty of evidence connecting Agent Orange exposure to a whole host of illnesses that only manifest later in life – including Diabetes. It's even on the VA's own site: https://www.publichealth.va.gov/exposures/publ…

How do you conclusively attribute diabetes to agent orange 40 years after the fact? What test do you run, and what scientific methodology do you employ?

We are real bad at connecting dots that take more than a few years to happen. So many other things happen to us every day. Even if some bad action doubles your odds of a certain outcome.. that means it is still 50/50 if the original thing "caused" your bad outcome.

Re: Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

#24
post #7

I expect a major pilot shortage in recent years. Not too long ago many of them were on strike [1] [2], due to apparently bad pay and high burnout. It really is a thankless profession. [1] https://www.cnbc.com/2023/06/29/southwest-pilots-union-lays-... [2] https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/united-ai...

It's a high skill profession in an industry that largely competes on cost. One will find similarly thankless jobs in manufacturing, agriculture, and any other industry where the push is to squeeze margins as much as possible. Everything about flying has become substantially worse except safety. The only way the industry is able to maintain its safety record is by being heavily regulated and never changing anything .

The difference of course, is that pilots can squeeze airlines almost infinitely if they want to, because without pilots, the whole operation stops. They're the difference between flights happening and not happening, and they aren't easy to replace, and certainly not easy to replace quickly

Honestly, I'm surprised they haven't flexed this more.

Re: Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

#25

I had a lifelong dream of becoming a pilot, but after my discharge physical and VA rating I realized I’d likely never be able to due to the diagnosed issues. This whole saga frustrates me (it’s been going on for a while) because if you actually have the problems you’ve gotten the VA to acknowledge, and the FAA says they are an issue… Well you are lying and gaming the system on one side or another. I’m not a fan of th…

I sustained a back injury while on active duty. I have a rating for my back. 90% of the time, I'm able to function normally. Every once in a while, I re aggravate the injury and I'm laid up for a week or 2.

The disability rating ensures I'm able to get treatment from the VA for my service connected condition. I still pay for my own health insurance and see private doctors as the care the VA provides is garbage, but I have it as a back stop if I ever fall on hard times.

Having a disability rating doesn't strictly mean you're disabled, that would be a 100% disability rating.

Re: Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

#26

I expect a major pilot shortage in recent years. Not too long ago many of them were on strike [1] [2], due to apparently bad pay and high burnout. It really is a thankless profession. [1] https://www.cnbc.com/2023/06/29/southwest-pilots-union-lays-... [2] https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/united-ai...

Sadly it's a bit like game development. Pilots love to fly, that's why they went through all the time and effort to qualify and unfortunately, the corporations that hire them know and abuse that fact.

Re: Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

#27

"The pilots who have had their records examined are military veterans who informed the Federal Aviation Administration that they were suitable to fly, but didn't disclose that they were also receiving veterans benefits for various disabilities that could prevent them from effectively sitting in a pilot's seat." This is just my anecdotal observations, but I've seen that military veterans are extremely adept at gaming…

> I've known and worked with multiple veterans and each one of them gamed these systems to maximum benefit.

So exactly like private employees & companies?

I'm not sure we should be expecting humans not to game systems to their own benefit. Isn't that basic human nature?

Re: Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

#28

"The pilots who have had their records examined are military veterans who informed the Federal Aviation Administration that they were suitable to fly, but didn't disclose that they were also receiving veterans benefits for various disabilities that could prevent them from effectively sitting in a pilot's seat." This is just my anecdotal observations, but I've seen that military veterans are extremely adept at gaming…

> This is just my anecdotal observations, but I've seen that military veterans are extremely adept at gaming the system to their benefit. They are able to maximize disability benefits as well as GI Bill benefits. I've known and worked with multiple veterans and each one of them gamed these systems to maximum benefit.

"gamed" is a very loaded term that suggests something untoward is happening as opposed to people just trying to get the benefits they're entitled to as Veterans. Do you have any evidence that the people you've observed are doing something shady or do you just think they're getting more than they deserve?

> It also appeared that they coached each other on how to obtain maximum benefit.

Is it "gaming" the system when I offer my friend advice on how to navigate the byzantine health insurance system in the US?

Re: Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

#29

"The pilots who have had their records examined are military veterans who informed the Federal Aviation Administration that they were suitable to fly, but didn't disclose that they were also receiving veterans benefits for various disabilities that could prevent them from effectively sitting in a pilot's seat." This is just my anecdotal observations, but I've seen that military veterans are extremely adept at gaming…

> I've seen that military veterans are extremely adept at gaming the system to their benefit. They are able to maximize disability benefits as well as GI Bill benefits. I'm not in the USA but really to me that's just seems like they are getting what they should. Any citizen of any country should get medical care free of charge. Military veterans whether their issue is from combat or not I think should get all the car…

These benefits (and the gaming of them) are not about receiving medical care. These veterans already get free medical care from the VA. It's about monetary payments. They game the VA disability system to get paid.

Re: Feds probing roughly 5k pilots suspected of withholding major health issues

#30
Always struck by contrast - aviation regulators who’ve embraced and benefited immensely from no-fault safety reporting can’t seem to rationalize that the entire medical qualification system for pilots is killing people (literally in the case of German Wings).

System as designed encourages concealment by ending careers and destroying livelihoods. One obviously can’t fly commercial airliners impaired or with a material medical condition, but one can’t manage that risk without data. We need a no-fault early retirement fund or some similar mechanism needs to be out there to help get psychologically distressed pilots out of the cockpit and into treatment…with a possible path back too.

Just a terrible and inhumane situation all around.

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