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Seven Sins of Writing

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Re: Seven Sins of Writing

#91

Post by sacado2 »

cebert wrote: post #5

I’ve always seen recommendations to avoid passive voice in writing. However, when I encounter passive voice it doesn’t bother me. It also is one of my more frequent writing mistakes. Is this still considered bad practice?

Passive voice makes sense when the topic of interest isn't the subject.

Look at those headlines about Kennedy's death: https://www.manisteenews.com/news/slideshow/10-front-pages-f... Most of these headlines are passive, because the topic of interest isn't the (unknown) murderer, or the bullets themselves, but the victim.

"Kennedy assassinated, Connally seriously wounded by shots" is way stronger than "somebody assassinated Kennedy, shots seriously wounded Connally". Ditto with "Kennedy to be buried in Arlington", which is way better than "a person will bury Kennedy in Arlington".

Re: Seven Sins of Writing

#92

Post by wizofaus »

Denote6737 wrote: post #62
martinjacobd wrote: post #6

I wish I understood what "wordiness" means. Perhaps it's restating the same simple point three times in as many loose sentences. People who harp on this point usually point to the writing of Hemingway and similar writers (Carver comes to mind). All of these men are better writers than I am, but I still prefer to read Nabokov. Could Nabokov have "made his point" in fewer words? Almost certainly, but I wouldn't have en…

To understand wordiness read any of Dickens with the fact he was paid based on the length of the book. Not the sales. He will describe, in excruciating detail, the inconsiquential aspects of a one time characters outfit.

He's hardly the only author from that period given to what today would be considered extravagantly verbose prose. Lots of things were different about that age - arguably the typical readers of a Dickens or Bronte novel wouldn't have the exposure to the variety of experiences we take for granted these days, and intricate descriptions of seemingly inconsequential details were their equivalent of the saturation of the senses we now get from TV/cinema etc. And remember he was also capable of sentences like "It was the best of times, it was the worst of times"...which is about as succinct and powerful you can get given the complexity of what he was describing.

Re: Seven Sins of Writing

#93

Post by rogual »

> PASSIVE VOICE: My first trip abroad is one I will always remember.

This is the first time I've heard such a construction described as being in the passive voice by an authoritative source. Is it a mistake, or has the meaning of "passive voice" changed?

Re: Seven Sins of Writing

#94

Post by d--b »

rogual wrote: post #93

> PASSIVE VOICE: My first trip abroad is one I will always remember. This is the first time I've heard such a construction described as being in the passive voice by an authoritative source. Is it a mistake, or has the meaning of "passive voice" changed?

It's a mistake. The passive voice of the sentence "I will always remember my first trip abroad" is "My first strip abroad will always be remembered by me".

Re: Seven Sins of Writing

#95

Post by didntcheck »

d--b wrote: post #94
rogual wrote: post #93

> PASSIVE VOICE: My first trip abroad is one I will always remember. This is the first time I've heard such a construction described as being in the passive voice by an authoritative source. Is it a mistake, or has the meaning of "passive voice" changed?

It's a mistake. The passive voice of the sentence "I will always remember my first trip abroad" is "My first strip abroad will always be remembered by me".

Yet another tip in the "person saying 'passive voice bad!' unable to actually identify it" jar then

Re: Seven Sins of Writing

#96

Post by rwoerz »

Some sins of technical writing:

Undefined/vague abstractions or methaphors: Leave the meaning of notoriously overloaded terms like component, plugin, container etc. unexplained in your specific context of writing.

Homonyms: One term has several meanings. E.g., "server" is either a machine or a OS process.

Synonyms: One meaning has several terms. E.g., "module" and "project" in Maven.

No examples: Only rely on the reader ability to interpret pure abstractions instead of giving him/her examples to abstract from. E.g., provide only the EBNF of a certain language.

Re: Seven Sins of Writing

#97

Post by didntcheck »

watwut wrote: post #75
hp6 wrote: post #67

PASSIVE VOICE: Thomas Jefferson’s support of the new Constitution was documented in a letter to James Madison. ACTIVE VOICE: Thomas Jefferson documented his support of the new Constitution in a letter to James Madison. IMO the passive voice makes much more sence for this example.

Imo, the difference is in the focus. The passive voice version makes the "support of the new constitution" the most important thing the sentence is about. The active voice makes "Thomas Jefferson" the most important thing the sentence is about. So, it really depends on what the rest of the paragraph is supposed to be about.

Which is why the blanket aversion many style guides have to the passive voice makes no sense. Use it when it makes sense to use it, obviously. Often, the subject of the verb really is of little importance, particularly in formal accounts of events

Re: Seven Sins of Writing

#98

Post by sosull »

woolion wrote: post #64
kshacker wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmmm, let's demonstrate wordiness :) > I wish I understood what "wordiness" means. Perhaps it's restating the same simple point three times in as many loose sentences. Does wordiness mean restating the same simple point three times in as many loose sentences? > People who harp on this point usually point to the writing of Hemingway and similar writers (Carver comes to mind). All of these men are better writers than I…

>I personally find it a joy to read Nabokov despite his wordiness, and I do not think my reading enjoyment is related to being wordy. > [original:] Could Nabokov have "made his point" in fewer words? Almost certainly, but I wouldn't have enjoyed them any more. This sentence is a great example of how the main semantics of the sentence are actually the same but their subtext are entirely different. In both cases, the m…

Book hack: some lengthy autobiographies have an ‘about the author’ section on the inside cover.

Re: Seven Sins of Writing

#99

Post by didntcheck »

cebert wrote: post #5

I’ve always seen recommendations to avoid passive voice in writing. However, when I encounter passive voice it doesn’t bother me. It also is one of my more frequent writing mistakes. Is this still considered bad practice?

It's not a mistake or bad practice at all. I really don't understand the hate for passive voice in style guides (particularly American ones, IME). It's like saying "palm muting is the first sin of guitar playing". No, it's a valid aesthetic choice that everyone will have a different subjective opinion on in different contexts. There are also many contexts when the subject of the verb is of little importance, so passive voice is the more obvious choice

The one exception is writing where accessibility is key. Apparently there is objective evidence that EAL and lower-ability native speakers may find it confusing to parse, but if you're instead writing "to entertain" (in a very broad sense), or for a high-ability audience, this likely is not relevant

The other justifications like "active voice strikes the object" just sound like standard bad linguistics and getting hung up on the name, rather than any valid critique

As for "it's used to shirk responsibility" ("mistakes were made") - that's plenty easy to do in active voice ("experts say x"). Shiftiness is a function of semantic content (or lack thereof) not grammar, and people generally aren't stupid enough to not notice you dodging just because you did it in passive

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